View Full Version : Fake meat

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Jul 25th, 2004, 09:57 PM
hmm... Someday when I have children I would like to raise them vegan. Even if my wife was a meat eater. Oh and explain to her (when she's old enough) the truth about all this meat deal. I am no parent, buy you know how most parents would personify stealing as wrong and under no circumstances do you steal?? Go about it like that only with meat I should think because its the truth right??

Jul 27th, 2004, 09:57 AM
i love tofu and seitan. i've made seitan once, which was actually kind of fun, but not quite as tasty as the stuff that i've bought. i also like tempeh, although i find it the kind of thing i can only eat once in a while, and i don't usually eat it plain like the other two. i eat some meat substitutes, such as veggie burgers, hot dogs, and meatless meatballs, but all of those foods never resembled meat much int he first place. i prefer my veggie burgers to be more "veggie patties" with an emphasis on using grains and vegetables rather than textured protein to resemble meat. meatballs and hot dogs were always more fillers than actual meat anyway. my mother once bought me fake salami, but i couldn't do more than sniff it as the meaty smell bothered me so much.

Jul 27th, 2004, 08:27 PM
I used to eat seitan (pronounced saytan) and a TVP made of organic steam processed soy. I actually ate them long after going veggie, so there was no wish to find a corpse like substance, I just wanted some dense chewy food. It didn't last long. After going vegan I did some reading about nutrition, digestion, and food processing. Now my favorite thing to put in burgers is falafel or mushroom. No more heavily processed gunk for me thank you.

For those unfamiliar with the reason for eating mushrooms, shitaki and many other wood grown mushrooms are nutritionally superior to 'meat', have fiber, and of course don't require the death of animals. I am growing Shitaki and Enokitake in my kitchen at home (it's very easy actually), and will be growing morels and portobello soon. Mature mushrooms can be prepared like traditional omni dishes, or many other creative ways. They have the savory taste that some new vegans miss, and many have a nutty flavor (like shiaki, morel, and gods mushrooms). There are actually dozens of mushrooms that can be grown by hobbyists, all with unique taste and texture. Some are high yield like oyster mushrooms, and some can be grown in your refrigerator or a cellar quite easily (like oyster and winter mushrooms). A few require very constant climate and take up to two years to fruit, but that is not the norm. In fact many varieties can be harvested twice a month. Anyway, I like mushrooms.

Jul 27th, 2004, 09:34 PM
that rules! i like mushrooms too but organic ones are so expensive. i want to grow mushrroms--can you give me a hint at where to start? thanks.

Jul 27th, 2004, 10:05 PM
ooh, i'd love it if phillip could start a homegrown mushroom thread! i'm very interested.

Jul 28th, 2004, 08:11 PM
I just bought organic kits. You can clone whatever you get in the kit. Most kits are just pre grown mycelium on a block of whatever medium. Since they are an established gorwth you don't really have to worry about contamination like you do with cloning or spores. There is quite a bit of information on the web about growing mushrooms at home. You can grow them in jars, aquariums, or even on logs in your yard or cellar. It's really not difficult once you understand how shrooms grow. My kits were around $20 and they've already paid for themselves quite a few times. In fact I'm even considering growing them professionally because they are so easy to grow. I think a lot of the hype about how hard they are to grow is just anti-competitive behavior at its best.

Sep 13th, 2004, 07:23 PM
I am talking about soy-based products, such as burgers, hot dogs, sausage, bacon, et cetera. I don't think tofu qualifies, but I could be wrong; I just don't think tofu is trying to act like something else that would be an omnivore food. (talk about personification - now tofu is acting!)

Anyway, I find that when I see vegans and vegetarians eating such things, it's not necessarily bad, but a lot of times, this is the case:

1. They feel that this is the only source of adequate protein;
2. They therefore neglect the healthier foods, like whole grains, fruits, vegetables, legumes, and nuts;
3. They do not cook and experiment and only eat those "convenience" foods, similar to an omnivore diet except obviously healthier.

To me, the best part about being vegan is cooking with so much different choices. We have so many vegetable-legume-whole-grain-nut combinations, it's unbelieveable. It's also amazing how dessert can be made with nuts and fruit and be so delicious.

I also do not like the way the substitutes smell or taste, but that's not too relevant, I suppose.

What are your thoughts?

Sep 13th, 2004, 07:44 PM
i feel that for people who just became vegan and are used to such products, its great. but that once u are vegan for a while, u dont really feel the need to eat things that represent meat as there are so many more delicious things to eat. i am annoyed however that they all contain gluten!

Sep 13th, 2004, 09:10 PM
i don't really bother them with much anymore. i think too that they're useful for new veggies who don't realise there are tastier and healthier options avalable. they were handy for me as a teenager when everyone ate burgers and sausages and things. but the further away from an animal-based diet i have become the less i feel the need for these sorts of foods.

Sep 14th, 2004, 05:57 AM
I have nothing against them, and eat them myself, from time to time. However, it's mainly for convenience sake. But I do really like the taste of the Yves Breakfast Sausages.

Sep 14th, 2004, 07:53 AM
I could never eat 'not chicken' or 'not bacon'. The thought makes me just as sick as eating the real thing, but if that tickles your fancy, then I don't have a problem with it.

I am not a fan of meaty texture - I like veggie burgers that are veggie burgers - not ones that are supposed to mock meat. I have never tried a vegan sausage or hot dog - probably coz I am just not interested.

Ever since I was a little girl I loved beans - so I base my diet on that (Dhal anyone?) and rice

Kiva Dancer
Sep 14th, 2004, 11:11 PM
I still like the odd meat sub every now and again, but mostly it's the whole foods that take center stage on my plate.

Sep 16th, 2004, 04:42 PM
I love 'Veggie Ribs', and sometimes eat other meat substitutes when I am feeling a bit lazy.
I don't really see the problem with them. I used to love meat, and it's texture, but when I was a teenager began to realise where it actually came from, and went right off it!! So the substitutes are just a treat sometimes, but I could live without them.
I don't really understand why some people say it's wrong to eat them - i.e burgers are just burgers, it's just a word, isn't it? They can be made from anything, really.

Sep 16th, 2004, 04:44 PM
I don't think it's wrong to eat them; I'm sorry if it appeared that way.

I just think that certain people believe that they can't get enough protein without these substitute products, and I have also seen people eat a sandwich with meat substitutes and neglect to eat healthful foods, such as fruits and vegetables.

Sep 16th, 2004, 10:56 PM
I see nothing wrong with eating "meat" substitutes. I eat them all the time. I love Gardenburger's Riblets and Health Is Wealth No Chicken Nuggets. I feel good about eating them, because I know no animal died in their production. That's the kind of food I grew up eating, and it makes me feel "homey" to be able to find these foods in a vegan format.
I know a lot of vegetarians/vegans don't approve of them, because they think you're trying to emulate meat. If anyone has read "Becoming Vegan," by Davis and Melina, they recommend eating them. Some of the veggie "meats" are loaded with vitamins, and, of course, protein. They're also fast and easy to prepare when you're in a hurry or don't feel like cooking.

Sep 17th, 2004, 06:23 AM
My 11 year old Daughter and my Giant man like them occasionally and since we tend to eat so many complete and whole foods and mostly vegetables with legumes and grains, I know that the infrequent calorie/protein/B-12 rich supplemental food is ok for a growing girl who doesn't really care for soy or tempeh and a very large but lean man who was raised on no less than 2 dozen eggs a meal and 2 gallons of milk a day in addition to 4 carne asada burritos and about 3000 additional calories a day...Their bodies are more accustomed to eating more concentrated sources of protein because they were formed and raised on animal proteins. I do not believe that they *require* these concentrated foods, and at the same time I know they derive nourishment from them that is useful to building bodies and keeping weight on. The same nutrients are available in an all whole foods vegan diet, by eating a higher volume and variety of foods. I do not feel that "substitutes" are necessary at all.

I'd say maybe once or twice a month my family uses a veggie patty of some sort (they are good for my daughter when she goes to sleepovers and everyone is eating burgers) and a "Gimme Lean" brunch for the Giant and the Girl... :)

Personally, I am RAW and Living in my diet and so I don't use them at this time at all...

Sep 17th, 2004, 06:35 AM
Don't care for substitutes myself, but eating substitutes is far better than eating animals.

Sep 17th, 2004, 01:43 PM
I haven't found that many substitutes that I like. Though I am a fan of Boca Burgers, grilled and then loaded up with fresh veggies on a wheat roll! I do think it would be bad to rely on them, but I think they serve a nice purpose as another option.

Nov 4th, 2004, 09:17 AM
I'm finding I can't even eat the meat replacements. It just seems to much like meat.

How do you guys go about that?

Nov 4th, 2004, 09:31 AM
There is a buddist restaurant in Adelaide that specialises in faux-meat dishes in the most disturbing fashion despite almost all of the food being vegan. I have been there with several vegan andvegetarian friends, had a birthday with omni friends and Animal Liberation had a Xmas gathering there and each time it is amusing that I look directly for the vegetable dishes and the tofu variations - but almost everything is tofu or wheat gluten!
It is confronting to try and face such dishes as 'sizzling beef' since it is very realistic on a hot metal plate in the shape of a cow. Despite this is it always very good food and a great place to take people that feel that every meal requires animals to die. They even have fake fried crumbed king prawns but that kind of realism doesn't appeal. Give me a place that specialises in inventive vegetable preparation anyday.

A friend and former vegan used to eat gluten tinned duck - with moulded plucked skin. It was too much to face even knowing it wasn't animal and I am not usually squeemish. *shudder*

Nov 4th, 2004, 09:55 AM
I don't mind them once in a while - the fact that it's like meat doesn't bother me so long as I know for certain that it's not meat. (I agree with veganblue that some of the Buddhist "mock meats" are alarmingly realistic though - the first time I had them I had to doublecheck that the restaurant was completely vegetarian :D )

However, I know a lot of people can't stomach them - if I were you I just wouldn't buy them. There are plenty of other things to have.

Nov 5th, 2004, 01:41 AM
I don't do fake meat - it makes me sick. I went to world vegan day festival on Sunday, and there were all these fake meat dishes like "beef" and blackbean, not sausage rolls, "chicken" nuggets etc. They looked so real that I started to gag. My vegan food is vegan food - beans, rice etc... I am turned off by all of that stuff. When I have a burger - it MUST be a veggie burger, like I can see all the vegetables and stuff.

Nov 5th, 2004, 06:48 AM
What really amazes me is that I really loved meat just a few weeks ago!

Nov 5th, 2004, 10:16 PM
I guess I'm a weird vegan, because I like fake meat. Garden burgers, "chicken" nuggets, fake sausage patties, I like it all. I love tempeh, haven't tried seitan (have a package hiding in the fridge) and like tofu if it's made right. When I was still vegetarian, I liked morningstar corndogs and Boca bratwursts. Maybe my taste for it will wear off the longer I am vegan. I shouldn't eat so many processed foods, anyways.

Nov 6th, 2004, 05:17 AM
Seitan was made in china thousands of years ago bu buddhist monks to replace meat.
Not thousands of years ago tsunami - buddhism didn't reach China for over a thousand years after buddha's death, two and half thousand years ago. I'm interested that the monks made their own seitan instead of receiving alms from the supporting public.
As for me, like phillip, I grow mushrooms from a kit, and prefer lentils, beans, etc, though I do have the occasional tofu. :)