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Caramammal
Aug 11th, 2008, 01:51 PM
Did anyone watch this TV Programme in the UK last night?

It was extremely hard to watch, but I'm glad they showed it.

It basically was about a journalist who likes to wear fur, but given her 'ethical' preferences for food..i.e. she only eats free-range and organic meat (her interpretation of ethical), she set out to discover whether animals could in fact be killed humanely enough to justify her need to wear fur.

OK, it wasnt the best thing for a vegan to watch, and i pretty much cried the entire time, but I hope it touched someone, somewhere, enough to question not only the fur trade, but the food industry too.

A couple of things stick in my mind..

This journalist felt it was ok to wear beaver because they're pretty much like big rodents and the world would be overrun if they weren't culled. She completely missed the fact that it had drowned because it's foot was caught in a trap, and the blood around its mouth was because it has tried to free itself.

The guy running the Mink farm said the manner of death was ok because the pelt wasnt harmed, and neither was the Mink !!!! ...(maybe he thinks killing an animal isnt harming it...me thinks he needs to go back to school).

I wont describe the rest, those 2 were the less horrific examples, but needless to say, everytime i close my eyes I have a flashback to the programme.

Like I said, it wasnt the easiest thing to watch, and in fact, I couldnt watch the last 10 minutes.

As a vegan, do you tend to watch these types of programmes or avoid them altogether?

puffin
Aug 11th, 2008, 01:57 PM
I couldnt watch it, i saw it advertised and that was enough for me, i would just be to mad for to long. Did she change her mind at the end?

gogs67
Aug 11th, 2008, 02:13 PM
Watched it for 30 seconds and switched over, but i'm glad they are showing stuff like that on national TV!

sugarmouse
Aug 11th, 2008, 02:30 PM
I am the kind to bury my head in the sand about these programmes!I am already constantly upset about fur..I know waht happens, I dont need to have it in my face.
Shouldnt it be 'Skin it till it dies then wear it:('
But yes I am curious to the outcome too,and I am glad it was on tv.

BlackCats
Aug 11th, 2008, 03:03 PM
The guy running the Mink farm said the manner of death was ok because the pelt wasnt harmed, and neither was the Mink !!!!

(:rolleyes:)

I actually cannot believe people still wear fur anymore. I cannot watch any programme like this, it makes me too angry and sickened and I already have formed my views. I'm glad they do show these type of programmes even though I don't watch them.

veganlinda
Aug 11th, 2008, 03:06 PM
I didn't watch this but forced myself to watch the film about Heather Mills trying to stop the skinning of cats and dogs - left me with lots of flashbacks and feeling of hopelessness. Was glad I watched it as I didn't want to be blind to what goes on. Am glad they are now showing this kind of thing, unfortunately those sensitive enough to be touched by it may not want to watch it.

sandra
Aug 11th, 2008, 03:20 PM
I can't watch programmes like this either but I think that people who eat meat or wear fur should know how they get the meat and fur they end up with. Hopefully it will cause some people who have been burying their heads in the sand to face up to things and change their ways.

Risker
Aug 11th, 2008, 03:22 PM
She did change her mind at the end and destroyed and threw out all her fur - reason being that it was impossible to ascertain the origin of any fur bought and therefore impossible to find out if it came from 'humanely' killed animals or not.

horselesspaul
Aug 11th, 2008, 04:05 PM
therefore impossible to find out if it came from 'humanely' killed animals or not.
Happy fur.

gogs67
Aug 11th, 2008, 04:48 PM
Yep, i thought her reasoning pretty ridiculous but it's a means to an end i suppose to get this kind of thing on prime time TV!

RachelJune
Aug 11th, 2008, 07:53 PM
She did change her mind at the end and destroyed and threw out all her fur - reason being that it was impossible to ascertain the origin of any fur bought and therefore impossible to find out if it came from 'humanely' killed animals or not.

:)

Mr Flibble
Aug 11th, 2008, 10:28 PM
"Humane trapping" made me chuckle. She is clearly completely insane.

wildcatstrike
Aug 12th, 2008, 12:16 PM
I taped it but haven't had a chance to watch it yet. I didn't want to go to bed angry, hence why i taped it!

But i do try and watch programs like this though. i like to know what the program said and showed so if anyone at work etc mentions it i know what they're on about.

I don't think vegans should watch these programs though if it's gonna upset or depress them. We're against it already. It's people who wear fur, eat cheese, meat etc who i feel are morally obliged to watch them. Change their mind or not, they should find out what happens for their lifestyles/greed.

However, i think there are often benefits for vegans who do watch stuff like this. It can make you a more active and confident AR campaigner for one thing. It can also remind you how positive your own lifestyle is compared to people who get pleasure from wearing fur etc.

Cattmogg
Aug 12th, 2008, 05:28 PM
I kind of felt ike skinning her. :(

starlight
Aug 13th, 2008, 09:44 PM
As a vegan, do you tend to watch these types of programmes or avoid them altogether?


I avoid them. Actually I don't have a TV so I guess it's relatively easy, but in general I try and avoid disturbing images of all kinds.

I remember being bombarded by anti-vivisection campaigners years ago who were collecting signatures in a town center. They were putting these really horrible graphic images in people's faces, and it was way too much to cope with. It was also counterproductive - I was turned off from engaging with the campaigners, and to this day I associate horrible images with animal rights campaigners rather than "vivisectionists". lol.

Just my $0.02

wildcatstrike
Aug 14th, 2008, 12:15 PM
That's understandable, Starlight. Many people find those images upsetting. But i'm wondering how you felt about vivisection before seeing those pictures and if you realised it was so brutal? If it put you off approaching the protesters perhaps that is sad for them, but they wanted to put people off vivisection and it sounds like they succeeded with you.

The pictures are shocking, but that's the point. Vivisection is shocking. And i think it's good for campaigners to sometimes use images like that, because as your story points out, people get the truth about how animals suffer without even having to engage in conversation with the campaigners.

You can see those pictures a mile away, and the vast mojority of people would'nt stop and talk to these campaigners anyway, whether they use graphic images or not.

PS - i love that you don't have a TV! :D

starlight
Aug 14th, 2008, 06:59 PM
That's understandable, Starlight. Many people find those images upsetting. But i'm wondering how you felt about vivisection before seeing those pictures and if you realised it was so brutal?


I guess I never thought about it until that day


If it put you off approaching the protesters perhaps that is sad for them, but they wanted to put people off vivisection and it sounds like they succeeded with you.

The pictures are shocking, but that's the point. Vivisection is shocking. And i think it's good for campaigners to sometimes use images like that, because as your story points out, people get the truth about how animals suffer without even having to engage in conversation with the campaigners.


You're right, of course.

In the same way I think it was pictures of a chicken killing machine in operation that originally turned me vegetarian originally.

And it was pictures of combat operations that turned me against warfare.

I just wish I could get all those damned images out of my head now - or better still, make it all stop.


PS - i love that you don't have a TV! :D

Me 2. It's easy - just sell it or give it away. You'll probably enjoy the change, but if you don't you can always buy another one so it's really no risk.
:)

Lisey_duck
Aug 17th, 2008, 08:36 PM
I dvd/video them (or ask my family to) then watch them later. Partly cos I don't own a TV and partly because if I'm going through a crap patch generally (like right now - stress at work and partner away for nearly three weeks) there is no way I'm going to add something like that to it. But I do have this one lined up to watch, preferably before seeing offline AR friends who will want to discuss it. From what you've all said about how it ends, it sounds like one of the better programmes on subjects like this!

wildcatstrike
Aug 18th, 2008, 10:55 AM
I watched this last night. I thought it was amazing actually. Very well covered and put together, and i didn't even hate the woman in it because she was at least trying to think "ethically" about her clothing. And it turns out she won't wear fur anymore so that's a result. She proved what i've always assumed; that most people who wear fur don't have any idea how bad it is for the animals used.

That trapper bloke she went beaver trapping with was typical of the desensitized animal abuser though. "I never say kill, i say HARVEST" - and then he goes on to say "i'll kill em all, mothers, babies, dads, i don't care". Hmmm.

Oh, and the classic revelation that "the traps are painless to the animals, they don't feel a thing... but err...don't catch your hand in there cos it'll hurt like hell".

x-SaRaH-x
Aug 18th, 2008, 12:19 PM
I will quite often watch such films but they do make me extremely upset. I wouldn't watch it with my family becasue of that!

I suppose it's good it's shown though?

noodle
Aug 19th, 2008, 08:05 PM
I watched it, and cried, but I thought it might change a few minds (I hope so). I like to watch all of these type of programmes because...I don't know...I just like to face facts I suppose. That's why I watch all the Peta videos, even though it makes me cry, I never want to forget the harsh reality.

wildcatstrike
Aug 19th, 2008, 08:58 PM
^ well put, noodle.

Lisey_duck
Aug 21st, 2008, 06:54 PM
Finally watched it the other night. That trapper guy seems to be dealing with a lot of sh*t from Vietnam, and I admit to having wondered why the f**k the presenter thought travelling into the middle of nowhere with him and his gun was a remotely good idea. Also, I try not to invoke the Holocaust when discussing any topic other than the thing itself, but bloody hell it kept springing to mind during the scenes on the mink farm. That was rather distracting. Having said that, I'm glad the presenter didn't stop at seeing the less horrible end of fur farming and decide that it was ok - and also that the viewing public got to see the small, shit-encrusted cages, mink getting gassed and skinned and the piles of dead creatures in the knowledge that this is the absolute highest standard in the industry.

wildcatstrike
Aug 23rd, 2008, 11:10 AM
^ That trapper guy was obviously so desensitized to killing in Vietnam it's no wonder he thinks nothing of trapping, drowing, killing, skinning etc animals.

He was a walking contradiction though. He said that beavers are vermin and carry disease and must be killed to stop them taking over - but he had to drive 15 miles away from his home to find one, and he handled the corpse with his bare hands. no gloves! If he really believed them to be carrying disease why the hell would he touch one and cut it wide open without any kind of protection or sterilised equipment?

clearly he lives in his own world.