Need a reply to this stupid statement.

[Farflame]

I've found myself in one of those 'discussions' with a bunch of vegan-haters on another forum. I'm doing fine and there's a couple of other vegans helping out, and we're staying calm and polite. But somebody has just come up with something idiotic, which I know is false, but I can't think of how to word my reply properly, since I'm no expert on nutrition.

He says 'Humans cannot digest greens, they need animals to do this for them'. Amusingly, he then says 'Vegans have no idea how the digestive system works', so it's just begging for a reply.

So, I assume humans can digest greens? Is that comment as idiotic as it sounds? I'm fairly sure I manage to digest them fine :p

[Blueberries]

You'll find your reply in this article http://www.vegsource.com/news/2009/11/the-comparative-anatomy-of-eating.html, it's about the fact that human are closer in anatomy to herbivores than carnivores.


...since I'm no expert on nutrition
I think you're more knowledgeable than someone who claims that we need animals to digest our greens for us! :lol:

[Farflame]

Well yeah, I have a reasonable knowledge of food, but I'm not one of those who can whip up nutritional facts (I should learn). This statement was so odd though that it perplexed me and although it seems stupid, I thought I'd better double-check before replying. Thanks for the post, I've read stuff before on nutrition, I'll find something clear to reply with :-)

[Risker]

Never argue with an idiot, they'll drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

[AzureAngel]

There is a big difference between arguing and laying down the facts for them to digest. I say explain it in simple terms and dont try and change their mind, just give them the facts. That is how I have done it in the past.

[Risker]

^ I'm a total hypocrite BTW, I do it all the time.

[Farflame]

Never argue with an idiot, they'll drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

I also try to avoid these discussions, because I'm not sure you achieve anything, even if you 'win'. I think other people are correct when they say, it just forces people to dig their heels in. Infact, I sometimes think the more I 'win', the more it angers them and the worse I'm making the situation. Best to avoid it, but I got suckered into this one by initially just explaining that something that somebody said was incorrect (it was one of those 'The vegan diet is unhealthy and all vegans have health problems' type of arguments). I pointed out that I've been vegan for 11 years and haven't been ill once.... and then it dragged out......

I'm interested in your point there Risker. What do you mean by that? I have a feeling that some guy has deliberately attempted to be stupid, just to keep me arguing, and is now showing a bit of common sense. I feel like I've been led into a trap :lol2:

Oh yeah lol, I see what you're saying now. Clearly I'm equipped with enough idiocy to challenge them :lol2:

[leedsveg]

Never argue with an idiot, they'll drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

Very true Risker. I put people on "Ignore" but of course that's only good for the forum.

LV

[vegandingo]

He says 'Humans cannot digest greens, they need animals to do this for them'. Amusingly, he then says 'Vegans have no idea how the digestive system works', so it's just begging for a reply.

Your opponent has made the claim as being a fact. Ask him to back his statement up with facts that prove his position.

[VeganC]

This is just ridiculous. If we couldnt digest greens im sure more people would look at this lifestyle as a dangerous one, not a healthy one haha

[jackie]

Never argue with an idiot, they'll drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

excellent! i'll remember that :-)

[jackie]

i found this link...... don't know if it's true but tell him you don't eat grass!

http://www.quora.com/Human-Biology/Why-can-humans-digest-some-leaves-like-spinach-and-not-others-like-grass

and this..... http://www.ehow.com/list_7316466_foods-contain-cellulose_.html

interesting... i've learned something tonight.

[TheHRchannel]

To be honest, I'd laugh at that person.

[VeganAthlete]

Humans and non-human animals can very well digest greens and all sorts of other foods such as grains & most nuts! Cows pretty much live off pasture, sea animals live off kelp and algea...phytoplankton are also pretty much producers as well. Humans that came way before us would not have bothered hunting for berries, nuts and vegetation if humans could not digest them....before we were a modern civilization, people hunted and gathered (and some actually settled on territory and took up agriculture to replace hunting). Humans are equipped with some of the enzymes required to obtain macro-nutrients and micro-nutrients from different foods.

Yeah, I'm with HR, I'd probably laugh at them as well.

[odizzido]

This is really late but if people couldn't digest plants without eating animal stuff than all vegans would die......since vegans don't die off it's obviously not true.

[Maître]

Haha, it seems like this guy only listened to half of his primary school science lesson and took in the bit about not being able to digest grass but fell asleep for the other half which explained why and thus why we can digest other greens.

[VeganAthlete]

I know this is super random, but did anyone know that people could actually eat dry ice (or whatever it's called)...it's those bean looking things that protect packages in transit? That stuff is obviously not food, but the body digests it into a simple sugar so that it can be used by the body. In a sense, it's sort of environmentally friendly because it breaks down so easily when exposed to environmental factors!

[Risker]

^ Dry ice is frozen carbon dioxide. You put that in your mouth and it'll freeze your tongue in to a solid block.

If you mean packing peanuts, some are okay, some are not. For my business I buy them made of potato starch so that they're biodegradable and can be composted (you COULD eat them but I wouldn't). The more solid ones are made from plastics though I believe.

Some places use air popped popcorn as packaging material, Lush stores in the UK do I think.

[VeganAthlete]

^ Dry ice is frozen carbon dioxide. You put that in your mouth and it'll freeze your tongue in to a solid block.

If you mean packing peanuts, some are okay, some are not. For my business I buy them made of potato starch so that they're biodegradable and can be composted (you COULD eat them but I wouldn't). The more solid ones are made from plastics though I believe.

Risker, thank you for that clarification! Lol. Yeah, Dry ice would be a BAD thing to put into your mouth :P

There you go...it's potato starch. The whole packing peanuts thing popped into my head because I never looked into what our environmental science professor meant by edible packing peanuts...but I understand now. Yeah, she did mention that as well!

Yay! I am glad you are environmentally friendly with your business on top of being vegan! :D I actually bit into a packing peanut and I thought it was pretty gross. I was too curious about finding out how it was edible. I wouldn't do it again, though!

Oh wow...popped popcorn is pretty interesting to use for the purpose. Never seen it done, but it's most interesting. I am just flabbergasted by the amount of paper and plastic used by the US and other advanced nations :(

[Andy_T]

Oh wow...popped popcorn is pretty interesting to use for the purpose. Never seen it done, but it's most interesting. I am just flabbergasted by the amount of paper and plastic used by the US and other advanced nations :(

Unfortunately, without salt it tastes pretty meh.

There are lots of things you can make out of potato starch. I remember at the winter olympics in Lillehammer they made the one-time trays and food containers out of this stuff so that you could actually not just eat the goulash or whatever you bought, but also the plate on which it came.

My kids are totally fond of a toy called Play-Mais (http://www.playmaiscanada.com/) that is made of corn starch. It's basically coloured blocks of corn starch that you can cut apart and glue to each other simply using water - and when you're done with your artwork you can (and are encouraged to) eat it.

Best regards,
Andy

[VeganAthlete]

That is pretty neat!!! Talk about environmentally friendly :) The body will digest it just as if it were candy or rice...all starches and other forms of carbs are metabolized into sugars that the body can use as fuel. Who knows...perhaps future generations will be more savvy than we are and just eat their toys once they outgrow them or eat their plates instead of washing their dishes. Stuff like that sounds a little on the far edge, but totally possible.

[Andy_T]

Hmm ... now that I think about it, when omnis eat at McDeath, the paper box might actually be more healthy than the Big Mac contained in it... (not just less cruel to produce)

Best regards,
Andy

[VeganAthlete]

Hahahaha...don't forget that even the box would contain more grams of fat than the food we eat on a daily basis. I am sure the box soaks up the fat and lard that the meat can hold. Heck I think even the lettuce there is probably sprayed with funky stuff. I don't even want to think about the working conditions for those people who have to produce the billions of bags, containers, utensils, boxes, etc for the McDeath Franchise/Corp

[ChrisF]

I think it is really unevolved to hate someone because of what they eat. We all make choices and that's what we call freedom. When we tell someone that they can not do something that is perfectly acceptable and legal in the society we live in there is no longer personal freedom. There are things that I like in this world and things that I don't like so I simply avoid those things that I do not like. I can not say how many vegans and vegetarians I have meet especially where I live in the world that drink and smoke and are disgusted by KFC or McDonald's, I'm disgusted by the all of the whiskey and cigarette advertising in the city but it is what it is. My wife and children eat just about everything while when I cook they are stuck with what I cook, the choices they have made are personal ones and while I try to educate them about the health benefits of my diet it continues to be their choice. I do however insist on no junk food as we live in a country where fresh fruit and veg is available all year generally for less than one US dollar a kilo.

[CoolCat]

I think it is really unevolved to hate someone because of what they eat. We all make choices and that's what we call freedom. When we tell someone that they can not do something that is perfectly acceptable and legal in the society we live in there is no longer personal freedom. There are things that I like in this world and things that I don't like so I simply avoid those things that I do not like. I can not say how many vegans and vegetarians I have meet especially where I live in the world that drink and smoke and are disgusted by KFC or McDonald's, I'm disgusted by the all of the whiskey and cigarette advertising in the city but it is what it is. My wife and children eat just about everything while when I cook they are stuck with what I cook, the choices they have made are personal ones and while I try to educate them about the health benefits of my diet it continues to be their choice. I do however insist on no junk food as we live in a country where fresh fruit and veg is available all year generally for less than one US dollar a kilo.

It's not personal when you hurt others. But from what I get you follow a vegan/vegetarian diet for your own health only?

Laws change, so does what is considered "perfectly acceptable"... the US used to have black slaves, and that was legal and "perfecly acceptable". In many countries (and plenty still) women didn't have the right to vote and that was legal and "perfectly acceptable". Childeren used to work (and in some countries still do) from a very early age and there was no school for them, that was legal and "perfectly acceptable". Until recently gay men and women were denied to serve in the US military, that was legal and "perfectly acceptable". In most US states and many countries arround the globe gay men and women still don't have the same rights as opposite sex couples, that is legal and "perfectly acceptable".

We can only hope that laws and attitutes towards exploiting non-human animals will change one day, but going round telling it's a personal choice and perfectly acceptable isn't helping when so many non-human animals are abused. Maybe look into the ethical side of veganism as well instead of just doing the diet... the vegan outreach material out there is eye opening.