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gertvegan
Sep 26th, 2004, 05:50 PM
This is from "The Silent Ark" by Juliet Gellatley.

Many adults appear to be frightened by emotion. Anything which challenges, disturbs or upsets them is pushed into the darker recesses of the mind and they pretend there is nothing that can be done about it. Part of the reason is that if they accept something is wrong and should be changed, it automatically requires something of them, some action, some change in their lifestyle. And that is simply too demanding.

gertvegan
Oct 24th, 2004, 08:03 PM
Why are others not vegan?

It starts with a name: we don't hear about pigs, but pork; not cow meat, but hamburger; words designed to make people forget the origins of their food. The supermarket packaging is the same. You can rarely recognise the source. All of this is designed to keep people from making the imaginative leap from animal suffering to the choices they make in food.

This is also from "The pig who sang to the moon" by Jeffrey Masson. Apologies if this has already been mentioned.

PinkFluffyCloud
Oct 24th, 2004, 08:50 PM
Yes, I've always felt that way about names - they're misleading!!
If 'milk' was called 'Bovine Breast Milk', for example, it might put people off a bit, or if 'Eggs' were called 'Chicken's Menstrual Waste Matter Ovoids' or some such, the truth might out!! :D

Trendygirl
Oct 24th, 2004, 09:52 PM
When I was 13 I wanted to become vegetarian but I didnít last more than 6-12months and even then I wasnít really a vegetarian. I ate gelatine, occasionally fish and only knows what else. If my mum and others around me supported me then I would have stayed veggie but when you are 13, you havenít got a clue about what to eat and you have everyone constantly making you feel bad for being veggie it is near impossible. Thatís unless you are very outspoken which I was not and you have someone to turn to for support!

Then when I was 16 I started to give up meat and become veggie. Then when I was 21 I found out about the dairy industry but I didnít have the support I needed so I changed to Soya milk but still consumed eggs, cheese and yogurt. If I had someone who really knew about the issues then I think that I would have become vegan long before I did.

We should defiantly let people know that there are such things as vegans and that the dairy industry isnít ok!

kriz
Nov 6th, 2004, 08:48 AM
Why are some progressive, non-racist, feminist, organic friendly, down to earth, educated, peace loving people so opposed to veganism?? Why is veganism not part their"open" minded views? I don't understand why meat eating is so separate from their anti-violence preaching...Help me understand this.

I think all of us on the board at one point were ignorant about vegan issues. Something or somebody caught or interest, showed us the reality and we decided to take a stand. But what makes others just refuse any information and instead make sarcastic remarks? Not a very progressive attitude. I'm talking out of really bad experiences here...


:confused:

PinkFluffyCloud
Nov 6th, 2004, 09:23 AM
I never understand this - I guess they are just people orientated - or not as progressive as they think they are?

ConsciousCuisine
Nov 6th, 2004, 02:50 PM
Bingo! They are "Selective Progressives" ;)

eve
Nov 7th, 2004, 06:21 AM
They may be progressive, non-racist, non-sexist, but are they non-speciesist? :)

DontJustDoSomething, SitThere
Nov 7th, 2004, 01:58 PM
Why are some progressive, non-racist, feminist, organic friendly, down to earth, educated, peace loving people so opposed to veganism??
Because they're not progressive / educated enough.

eve
Nov 8th, 2004, 08:25 AM
Why are some progressive, non-racist, feminist, organic friendly, down to earth, educated, peace loving people so opposed to veganism?? Why is veganism not part their"open" minded views? I don't understand why meat eating is so separate from their anti- violence preaching...Help me understand this. :confused:
DontJustDoSomething... , not sure about their not being progressive/educated enough. Not long ago I dissociated myself from Greenpeace, as I'd assumed its volunteers were progressive and educated. But try to find a veg*an among them! I had several discussions, but gave up. Same applies to many of the Animal Lib organisations in Australia. I was a member of AL-NSW, and AL-Qld, but why would I support an organisation of volunteers who purport to be for the liberation of animals, yet eats them! At least AL-Vic members are all vegans, and proclaim that on their website. Same applied to when I was a volunteer with the Wilderness Society.

kriz, I believe that these people just enjoy eating animal body parts so much that they prefer to avoid thinking it through, so they can continue with their bbqs and sausage sizzles.

gertvegan
Jan 24th, 2005, 11:17 AM
Some people say they don't like to label themselves. Maybe these people are scared of failing. Maybe thats why some aren't vegan. :confused:

casey_veggoddes
Feb 1st, 2005, 12:13 AM
some ppl jus think that animals are inferior and were "put" here for them...

and some believe that vegans are nutritionally deficient... and these ppl are also the ones that have no clue about nutrition or follow Weston Price and NT....


Actually alot of NT people are ex-veg*ns. I'm on another board that is pretty much half veg/half NT, it can get pretty interesting. :cool:

Artichoke47
Apr 21st, 2005, 02:04 AM
Selfishness

Misconceptions regarding healthy diet

Not caring for animals

Thinking it would be "too hard" to "give up" _______

Don't think about food choices

Roxy
Apr 21st, 2005, 02:06 AM
"I love meat too much" is something I hear all too often. To be quite honest, it makes me sick.

Astrocat
Apr 21st, 2005, 03:33 AM
Ignorance

Because they care more about their own whimsical pleasure or conforming to others' expectations, than about innocents' suffering and lives.

They can't be bothered

They're addicted to the chemicals in the flesh or bodily fluids of animals

They're semi- or fully sociopathic

They don;t respect themselves, the world or animals' lives

They're unwilling to remove themselves from being part of the generic flock by being WEIRD (ie vegan)

There are bound to be others, but those seem to be the most obvious ones

:) What are your thoughts ?

kriz
Apr 21st, 2005, 05:41 AM
1, Ignorance - organic meat and dairy is okay.

2, Moderation is good. A few veggies and some chicken or fish is a well
balanced meal. No fancy complicated vegan diet for me.

3, A vegan diet is for the middle class - only. It's too expensive for
students and the working class


4, Vegansism is an extreme type of vegetarianism. It's an idealististic
and utopian diet no one is able to follow for a long period of time
without facing serious health problems.


5, I was a vegetarian for a few years... I didn't feel good... and my
doctor told me to start eating fish.

6, I eat so little meat that it can't do any harm.

Steph
Apr 21st, 2005, 06:41 AM
Conditioning. Since birth for some reason, I don't know how this conditioning evolved over the years. From day one it is taught it is fine and good and normal to kill and eat other animals, and their reproductive secretions. For us to go against this such an ingrained in our heads since baby-dom belief makes vegans not "normal", I can't believe it, I feel like I'm living in the Twilight Zone when people are so baffled on why I don't eat animals or their secretions..

eve
Apr 21st, 2005, 08:20 AM
Most people, in England at least, are brought up on 'meat & 2 veg', and built their meals around that. It takes a more intelligent person to question. Although I'm not an elitist, yet I consider that vegans per se are more intelligent than other humans, who, even if they are brought up against reality, would rather not know about it.

Cal
Apr 21st, 2005, 08:29 AM
I consider that vegans per se are more intelligent than other humans, who, even if they are brought up against reality, would rather not know about it.
Yep, that fits with my experience. :)

kokopelli
Apr 21st, 2005, 10:47 AM
A lot of people seem to either be ignorant of the suffering involved,

or they think that killing is an inevitable part of nature (animals kill each other, so it's 'natural' for us to do so too...notice also the prestige accorded to carnivorous animals...it's 'higher' in the food chain to be a carnivore),

or they just don't think about where food comes from at all,

or they believe animal produce is essential for health.

What annoys me is when I explain all this to someone, they acknowledge that veganism is a better way to live, but they just carry on eating meat regardless. (I'm thinking about my mum here). Then I think it's a case of inability to break habitual behaviour.

cedarblue
Apr 21st, 2005, 10:50 AM
apathy

sophia
Apr 21st, 2005, 05:46 PM
I always get the 'well what have we got these for' (pointing at teeth). I don't get that. Do we have teeth that look like they are supposed to be used for ripping up meat? can somebody tell me. Would like to have an answer to meat eaters when they use this excuse.

coconut
Apr 21st, 2005, 08:21 PM
I think it's a combination of conditioning and ignorance. If you're brought up to believe eating meat and drinking milk is perfectly natural, these beliefs are going to be ingrained on your personality. Also the reality of factory farming and the use of chemicals/antibiotics in food is surpressed. If they let the television cameras into a modern feedlot and followed the process right up to the Tesco shelves, I think a great number of people would renounce meat. Dairy would be much harder probably.

kokopelli
Apr 21st, 2005, 10:44 PM
I agree coconut, if schoolchildren were taken to slaughterhouses as part of the curriculum, meat-eating would be brought to a speedy end.

And if people saw the baby male calves being taken away from their distraught crying mothers, fattened up and slaughtered, they'd soon go off milk too. Especially if they got to see the state of the average dairy farm, running with excrement, the snotty-nosed cows limping with shit-coated udders through the grim industrial farmyard, pissing over one another and the quadbike riding dairyman. I just witnessed that scene yet again, this afternoon...milking time. :eek:

veganblue
Apr 22nd, 2005, 12:50 AM
What annoys me is when I explain all this to someone, they acknowledge that veganism is a better way to live, but they just carry on eating meat regardless. (I'm thinking about my mum here). Then I think it's a case of inability to break habitual behaviour.

My family can appreciate the vegan perspective but at times I think they're being polite so that I don't tell them any more and therefore don't have to change.

Educating people seems to be the way. Being approachable and gentle and trustworthy (some people could think that you make this stuff up). I am just as happy that people start thinking about it.

I met an amazing intelligent and well balanced guy that has said quite clearly from the beginning that he does not consider going vego in the foreseable future. On the other hand he has started thinking about it when he's cooking (noticing all the things that aren't vegan), and has questions he's been mulling over in between times.

Previously he didn't think about it, now he does. It's a beginning.