Things meat eaters say and do

[leedsveg]

Hi llhalvor and welcome to the forum.:thumbsup:

I'm sure your family are not bad people but sometimes people gathered in a family group say things that they perhaps wouldn't on a one-to-one basis with you. You continue to be strong, compassionate, mature and sensible with your veganism, even if your family members (currently) can't.

If it helps, just think of us lot as extended family, who are always here for you and totally on your side.

Leedsveg

[vava]

What everyone else said PLUS they sound like they have been giving it some thought to me and they were spurred on by guilt. Guilt is a terrible thing and it sounds like your chosen lifestyle has provoked some uncomfortable thoughts in your family. That and the evidence of it - could be seen as a GOOD thing! Your brother has clearly thought about even the wool on his back instead of the on the back of the animal that produced it.

Sounds to me like you are doing a good job - remember it is all about the animals so rubbing your face on wool isn't the problem - it is the fact that it has been stolen from the animal that is the problem. Onwards and upwards m'dear!

[kategrace]

What a horrible situation.

Close family sure have the ability to jerk those tears when they want to (or even when they don't).
I have been on the receiving end of this before and it just flat out sucks. The people that mean the most to you in the world and the people that are supposed to know you best just don't understand this new part of you- a part that which to you, is so very important.

This will get better with time. Trust me it will. With time comes knowledge and breathing space. As your family have a vegan presence around them now it is just natural that thier eyes and ears will be open to these ideas and voices and their tempers and perhaps thier unconscious guilt will settle and become more productive.

The current runs cool beneath the raging sea my dear. Best of luck!

[graham]

Not a nice thing to happen at any time of year, this was my first christmas as a vegan as well and generally my family were good about it but it's still frustrating when they come out with ridiculous comments. The best one being "so you just want all farm animals to die? because if we didn't eat meat they wouldn't be there". Yes that's exactly what I want, all animals to just drop dead:confused:

Ah well, now to look forward to the next family gathering...

[Back-Space]

Sorry llhalvor. That really sucks :( That must put a lot of stress on your shoulders, don't let it get to you. They're ignorant. I know a lot of people who are the same way. They're set in their ways and no matter what you say, there's no convincing them otherwise. I just try to keep to myself and if anyone makes a snide comment, I reply with an equally snide remark that I work to make them sound like an idiot. I love Christmas :D

[cxmnz]

I'm sure this thread is going to get very busy over the next few days after everyone returns from family gatherings! I had a couple of good comments this weekend - although my family have finally come around to me being vegan after several years, they still don't quite get it! I certainly didn't starve, although being ill and not really eating anything much at the moment meant I didn't even eat a small amount of what I could.

The first was "do you think you became vegan because I gave you soya milk when you were a baby?" from my mum, followed a few hours later by being told that the chocolates being passed round must be vegan because "they have soya on the ingredients, look..." - I pointed out that far higher in the list was milk, whey powder and something else dairy I can't remember, as well as the very prominent tagline on the box that said 'milk chocolate selection'! I also had a chunk of cheese thrown at me, but that was by accident (they were aiming for their dog who never seems to leaves my side when I visit), and it was far easier and amusing just to laugh that one off.

Luckily my family, while not being at all convinced by veganism, don't bother starting arguments about veganism these days as I've proved many times over that I know far more about food production and animal cruelty than they do - unfortunately these arguments have been replaced by ones about anarchism and capitalism which I'm equally well educated in, but as they're a far more subjective issue, makes for harder discussion with people who just don't get it. Ah well, drinking copiously soon saw to all that.

[The Queen]

Ilhalvor thats really crap, I'm sorry to hear about it :( my brother would never do that to me!

It's only because they feel threatened because deep down they can't justify their lifestyle. Also, it was probably all a joke to them and they can't empathize with how important it is to you and how hurtful they was.

The only thing I can say is try to be strong and not care. the reason some people don't get bullied is because they genuinely don't care what others think. Easier said then done though, I'm trying to do it too

[earthling]

This isn't particularly to do with veganism as such, more animal welfare generally, but I had a 'heated discussion' with my mum over the holidays when she said that she doesn't feed wild birds in her garden on point of principle because she 'believes in evolution'... in other words, if they can't survive without human help then they should die off, survival of the fittest and all that! When I asked her would she treat a human being in the same way (say, if they were starving on the streets) she said that was different (isn't it always 'different' when it comes to humans?) and that I was 'anthropomorphising' the birds, etc. I almost lost my temper...

Then I said 'it isn't wrong to care about animals' to which my dad replied 'It isn't wrong NOT to care about them either.' Erm... I disagree!

My parents are very supportive of my veganism, always make an effort to cook vegan food and buy vegan treats in for me and my boyfriend etc, and never bully me about it, but scratch the surface and their attitudes to animals can be quite alarming. :(

[harpy]

Earthling, that sounds rather difficult. I guess your parents are just doing the same as a lot of people do and creating an artificial separation between humans and the rest of the animal kingdom to justify doing what they want to do ("anthromorphising" only makes sense in this context if you have a world view in which only human suffering is important). Maybe they have a sneaking suspicion that you are right though? Some of the comments sound slightly defensive.

[pusskins]

Well, it wasn't something somebody said this time...

Was at a houseparty the other week where everybody brought some food. A couple of people had very kindly made some vegan food bits and bobs. We took along some homemade hoummous and biscuits.

One lady (who is very...big and outgoing and tends to be at the centre of everything and always has a story to tell and is always right...Can you picture what sort of person I mean?) brought out a massive block of cheese and started grating it at the table where all the food was in to a bowl, using one of those hand-held graters, the kind with a handle? I thought she would be careful...

So I took the food I wanted and went and sat down and started tucking in. And found it was scattered and flecked with the cheese. So I had to throw it away. And I felt rotten for having eaten some cheese.

I know I'm making a big deal about it, but it made me upset. And angry. However, I didn't say anything, as the lady is not somebody you could really say anything to. I've tried before! She's a "get stuck in and sod everybody else!" type.

So it wasn't anything anybody said. It was what somebody did :confused: I went and had a look later, and there was bloody cheese everywhere.

[VagabondVegan]

Actions are worse than words because if she said something you could 'lay it on her' but if its an action and you say something then you look like the one at fault for being picky and awkward...what I just said is no help just an observation but I know what you mean. :) Its the whole alpha male/female thing...need to remove her from the centre...um hmm...like lions just without...injuring her and killing her kids...hehe :P

[pusskins]

:D

Yes, I know what you mean about the whole not wanting to look picky and awkward and then having to justify yourself. I just stuck to my fizzy elderflower, which was all I could have because they didn't think anybody would be drinking soft drinks :rolleyes:

Anyway, enough ranting! I don't have to ever face that woman again!

[harpy]

How pesky. Not much point making a fuss after the event, but perhaps the next time you can erect an electric fence with gun turrets round the vegan food, or find some other equally subtle hint to drop ;) ETA oh, it sounds as if there won't be a next time.

[pusskins]

Ha ha! Yes, arrange a suitable Krypton Factor-esque course to get to the vegan food! Am kind of thankful there will be no next time... But I did get asked for the biscuit recipe by various people, so I have left my vegan mark for them to ponder on next time!

[VagabondVegan]

Sounds like a plan to me...OR...bring an array of the many Vegan body builders in the world to make another point ;)

[khadagan]

I would I could get money every time when I say I'm vegan and I get the response 'Oh, but I could never do that!', I would be sooo rich!!

[The Queen]

When I just told my dad (a vegetarian) that there is an erogenous zone on this site he seemed shocked that vegans engage in unholy activites: "but theyre supposed to be pure..." then "I bet theyre smearing themselves in bacon or something"

[VagabondVegan]

When I just told my dad (a vegetarian) that there is an erogenous zone on this site he seemed shocked that vegans engage in unholy activites: "but theyre supposed to be pure..." then "I bet theyre smearing themselves in bacon or something"

No no no thats silly...just the Vegan Bacon by Redwoods food bought at Holland and Barrets. Bit of an advertisement there...

[khadagan]

Lol your dad has a funny head on him!

[khadagan]

'But what would we so with all the cows if everybody suddenly went vegan?' (a compelling reason for all of us to turn omni immediately ;))

'but don't you know that cows like being milked?' (not the same person I swear!)

[khadagan]

So=do

:)

[VagabondVegan]

'but don't you know that cows like being milked?' (not the same person I swear!)

Yeah because cows like being genetically bred to have ridiculously huge udders that cripple them just to provide more milk for us...and thats what I say to those people :)

[khadagan]

And the last one for tonight..'you do know that you are not changing the world with this behavior? You are only making it harder for yourself..'

My response to this usually is that I'm not trying to change anything, but living life the best and in the most just way I know. I usually add that I couldnt live with myself if I would participate and therefore condone the exploitation of and mass murder of animals for no point at all. I often get a few seconds silence after this and sometimes an apology.

Anyway on this happy note I'm going to get some sleep! ;)

[harpy]

And the last one for tonight..'you do know that you are not changing the world with this behavior? You are only making it harder for yourself..'

My response to this usually is that I'm not trying to change anything, but living life the best and in the most just way I know.

Good response, khadagan, although I think you actually are changing the world as well - have you seen those figures about how many animals etc the average omnivore consumes in a lifetime? That's before you take into account the influence you may have on other people, who may rethink their eating habits a bit as a result of knowing you, even if they don't all become vegan.

[The Queen]

I would say, Were nnot changing the world, but since omni's have 95 animals a year slaughtered for them on average (and that's only including direct meat consumption) by going vegan we arent saving or changing anything, we're just not having it killed. We're not doing anything good, we're just doing less bad