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whalespace
Jun 28th, 2006, 04:55 PM
Certainly worth a try for 5 or 10 years Antonia.

I understood that the RELAXING effect of this central nervous depressant was a key factor in the reduction of heart disease.I reckon YOGA rinses the pants of wine-a-day adherance. Anyhow, worry not, I heard that the "special ingredient" of wine was available in tablet form.

Possibly helpful ideas:
Ethanol is an excellent solvent which can be used for extracting herbal essences from gardens; something you might have more time for if you quit drugging yourself in order to lower your pleasure threshhold.
So medicinal purposes....can you justify drinking somone elses medicine?
A powerful method in the pursuit of abstinence is to ask oneself the direct question " At this moment in time, how could I best help myself and my friends....?"
Should I a] ....drink the poison [burn the plastic...etc]?
OR b] ...help myself and friends?
This also transforms the act from abstinence to positive action.
The more you follow through, the more you learn.
;) :) .

cvC
Jun 28th, 2006, 06:06 PM
also why not try stuff like Purdeys at Partys, can be bought in most health food stores all natural , I drink this when ever I drive or want a non alcho drink it really lifts the zing in the body and makes you very perky.

I used to drink Purdeys until I read in this thread that Red Wellies had discovered that their Activation and Rejuvenation drinks aren't suitable for vegans - it's post 41:

http://veganforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5979&page=2

catalina
Jun 28th, 2006, 06:37 PM
Hi Antonia, I haven't drank any alcohol for about three years. The looks I get when I announce that I don't drink are quite similar to the looks I get when I say I don't eat meat. So it shouldn't be that different for you since you're already a vegan!

After a while you don't miss it at all and it becomes totally normal. And if once in a while you do have a glass of wine or whatever, you'll find it pretty awful and you probably won't want to again. (Sound familiar?)

chickendude
Jun 28th, 2006, 10:44 PM
I opted to go for grape juice instead of wine

Here's an excerpt from an e-mail I received from Minute Maid:
"...Additionally, some of our suppliers use a common industry practice for grape juice clarification that does involve animal by-products. This practice is becoming increasingly less common as ultra-filtration systems are gradually replacing the gelatin used in this process..."

Just be careful as you drink your grape juice!

By the way, I call myself straight edge as well. Coming up on a year next month. I didn't see you mention caffeine, which I found odd seeing as caffeine is an incredibly addicting drug.
:)

wilson
Jun 29th, 2006, 12:18 AM
Maybe he didn't mention caffeine because this is a thread about alcohol?

foxytina_69
Jun 29th, 2006, 12:38 AM
good job antonia!

cvC
Jun 29th, 2006, 09:30 AM
You wanted supprt in your decision not to drink any more alcohol, Antonia, and this is something from a fasting website - I believe that the vegan diet I've at last kept to for a decent while has been instrumental in helping me to at last draw away from the problem I've had with it:

"Alcohol is a demon that hunts the wounded, suffering, and weak. Some are more prone the pitfalls of alcoholism than others, such as high intelligence, difficult childhood, alcoholic parents, warm and compassionate personality, even an inquisitive mind. For an intelligent, sensitive person, alcohol is an easy escape, numbing the mind from the responsibility of a harsh world.

Science has proven that alcohol is a carcinogen and mutagen. Research studies have found that even one drink per day can double the risk of developing breast cancer. Alcohol kills brain cells, degenerates the heart muscle, damages the liver, and can deform an unborn child.

Alcohol causes a sharp mind to become dull. Intoxication is the brain's response to being poisoned. Concentrating and focus become work, trying to wallow through a mental fog. How can God communicate with such a mind? It is a perfect setting for Satan's tricks because a mind that is unable to focus is wide open to being led astray by his repetitious whispers. It is Satan's way of preparing the mind for his most degrading and sickening suggestions that normally would appall us.

If you turned to alcohol at sixteen years of age, then emotionally and mentally you will continue to have a sixteen-year-old mind as long as you drink. Spiritual growth is impossible. Alcohol becomes the comfort of your mother, the security of your father and rules your life like a god. Its solvent properties seep into the deepest recesses of the character. Another terrible tool of control in Satan’s deadly arsenal."

http://www.freedomyou.com/addiction/alcohol%20addiction.htm

Mr Flibble
Jun 29th, 2006, 09:50 AM
Spiritual growth is impossible

A single definition of spiritual growth and how it is attainable is highly dubious. Some could just as equally argue that spiritual growth is impossible without drugs. Others could equally argue it's an effective tool (http://tperkins.com/shaman/drugs_as_a_tool.htm).

cvC
Jun 29th, 2006, 10:02 AM
Some could just as equally argue that spiritual growth is impossible without drugs. Others could equally argue it's an effective tool (http://tperkins.com/shaman/drugs_as_a_tool.htm).
You're interested in Buddhism and may or may not know that one of the five principal precepts is to abstain from intoxicating substances. This is something from Proverbs in the Old Testament:

"Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise."

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=24&chapter=20&version=9

wilson
Jun 29th, 2006, 05:34 PM
didn't jesus turn water into wine? also, I believe the refreshments he laid on at his last supper included wine. does that place him in 'Satan's deadly arsenal' ?

or is all that satan talk just a bit silly and misplaced?

a group of adults should be able to talk about alcohol use in 2006 without bringing satan/jesus/the bible into it, surely? or maybe my mind has become 'a perfect setting for satan's tricks'

:rolleyes:

Antonia
Jun 29th, 2006, 05:44 PM
Thank you all for the encouragement. Why can't friends/family be like that? I think I need some vegan or at least health conscious friends.


why not try stuff like Purdeys at Partys, can be bought in most health food stores all natural , I drink this when ever I drive or want a non alcho drink it really lifts the zing in the body and makes you very perky.
I've never seen it, but I'll be sure to look out for it. Thanks.


You have to ask yourself if a label is gonna enrich your life in any way. You may already have been following the tenents of sXe without knowing it exists.
Pilaf, I don't think a sxe label would particularly do much for me, but it's nice to know that if I come across a sxe conversation/people I can identify with it. It's also nice to know of a like-minded group of people from whom I might get inspiration and support. Just like this forum really. I'll drink my grape juice to that too:)


Best of luck with your decision :) You could find a local Buddhist centre and start going there regularly. Most have meditation classes and talks etc. You're bound to meet other non-drinkers there. .

Thanks coconut. I've now made plans to go to a Buddhist centre tomorrow. Not been to one before. I've only just started to read up on Buddhism. I love it's philosophies and I'd love to get into meditation.


Life has too many things to offer and alcohol drinking is certainly harmful to health. .

I'm with you on that. I believe it is harmful to health, period, even in moderation. Ok if you don't drink much and eat well your body can probably deal with it, but what else could your body be doing if it wasn't having to waste it's time countering the alcohol. Hoorah for the body as a temple!


but isnt alcoholism hereditary? ... i wanna give up sugar though.........im gonna give it up in a month, cause thats my 1 year vegan birthday:D .

If that's true it's without a doubt best that I don't drink. Good luck with the sugar and for in a months time.. Happy V-day!

Herbwormwood, I too don't want to put a toxin into my body that I don't have to. Why do people encourage eachother to poison themselves? Humans are so odd.

Good luck absentmindedfan. Not wanting to turn out like my mother is high in my list of motivational reasons too.

Thanks for the advice whalespace. I agree that if focusing on the positive benefits of not drinking rather than the fact that I'm NOT drinking makes a lot of sense.


if once in a while you do have a glass of wine or whatever, you'll find it pretty awful and you probably won't want to again. .

Very true. Often in the past when I've had a drink I've realised that I didn't enjoy it as much as I thought I would. Congrats on 3 years of tee total living.

Antonia
Jun 29th, 2006, 05:50 PM
good job antonia! Thanks foxy!

Wow, thanks cvC. Some strong words there. A bit OTT for me 'satans tricks'... but thought provoking and not given in a 'fluffy bunny' way. I will be sure to check out the link.

chickendude
Jun 29th, 2006, 06:56 PM
Maybe he didn't mention caffeine because this is a thread about alcohol?
Sorry.

Pilaf
Jul 2nd, 2006, 04:49 PM
I didn't see you mention caffeine, which I found odd seeing as caffeine is an incredibly addicting drug.
:)

If you want to discuss caffeine's role in sXe, by all means join the forums and mention it. You'll find that over 95% of all adherents feel that caffeine has nothing at all to do with sXe. A drink of tea or coffee is not mind altering in any way, and has never been proven to have crippling long term health effects like, say, tobacco.

Anyway, good luck to the OP with her decision to stop drinking alcohol. I'll support you no matter if you decide to stick with it or not, because you're trying something to improve your life from your pov, and that's commendable.

About the grape juice thing, I don't really care. I realize that most fruit juice manufacturing methods are probably not vegan, but I don't extend my veganism that far. With my budget and schedule, I frankly don't have time to obsess. If there are no animal ingredients listed, I consider it vegan enough for me.

tabitha
Jul 2nd, 2006, 06:51 PM
Im not going to be drinking in the week from now on. Im trying to persuade VeganBikerBoy to do the same.

Antonia
Jul 4th, 2006, 01:41 PM
Im not going to be drinking in the week from now on. Im trying to persuade VeganBikerBoy to do the same.
Good 4 u!!!

I think my bf has been a little disappointed that I haven't wanted to go the pub with him the past week, but I want to be ultra confident about my abstinence when I put myself in that sort of environment. I hope you and VBB can provide some support for each other.

I've found a replacement vice now too, sunbathing! Overdid it at the weekend though. I should perhaps put my bf's reaction to my burnt bottom on the spanking thread.

ladyaprille
Jul 5th, 2006, 02:37 PM
ive been teetotal for 3 years now and trust me - from age 16 when ur meant to be getting drunk and wasted at parties.. it was hell - not because i wanted to do it, but bcos people thought i was above them and growing up too fast.. b*ll*cks.. ermm i did it bcos one side of my family are alcoholics and one person in particular. I hate how he is wasting life drinking and that he doesnt care about the future. its as if he can be at one daughters wedding (my older sisters) but its just *good luck* if hes at mine..

my mum is tea total and im very proud of her for commiting herself to this
wen people ask, i say it loud and proud.. its my life it effects and its my life that will probably turn out longer and happier than those who r binge drinkers.

alcohol in moderation, i have no problem with. but i dont see the point in changing your personality when u go out to have a good time.. love who u r, and have the confidence to go out and have fun without having to induce it with alcohol.

:) prilly xxx

herbwormwood
Jul 5th, 2006, 04:08 PM
A while back I was doing a course, and a copper came to give us a presentation with question and answer session on drugs and the law etc. One of us asked him which drug he thought was the most dangerous and harmful. His reply: Alcohol.

AbFab
Jul 5th, 2006, 11:03 PM
Just to add my name to the list of y'all who don't drink, and hopefully offer you some support and encouragement. Never got into it, it just didn't appeal. If one group of friends were doing an activity, and one group were going to the pub, I'd always opt to go with the doing something option. I love spending quality time with friends, but I've just never really gotten the appeal of sitting in a smoky pub to do so, paying over the odds. I've tasted alcohol, just a sip of the odd thing here and there, nothing took my fancy, and I saw no point in acquiring the taste. I've never had any problems with anyone challenging my choices; many are inquisitive, but it's always in a nice, genuine way. Many tease me, but again, I take it in the good-natured way it was intended. One group of friends have been using the same gag on me for 15 years, bless them (always offering me a beer and a cigarette)! I don't make a big deal about it if new people discover that I don't drink (like it's really so weird?), I just say it's just how I am and always have been. (I only turned vegan at 25, so was a non-drinker first. Now new people think I don't drink as a result of my veganism.) I have never felt the need for it to relax OR to perk me up. I am chilled enough naturally, when I need to be, but can easily morph into the person most likely to be found first on the dancefloor ... and last off it. (Partly maybe 'cos come 3 o'clock most of the people in the place are jibbering wrecks and I'm better off just throwing some shapes of my own!) Each to their own, as long as no-one is getting hurt. I also am less likely to get myself into any tricky situations, and were I too, somehow, I'd like to know I have my maximum wits about me. Like, I'll always be able to drive, if there was an emergency, or I'll always be able to be level-headed if called upon. I also don't particularly see the appeal in being out of control. Nor in hangovers and feeling sick and dehydrated the next day. And yeah, I've saved an absolute fortune over the years. There was some calculator tool that was going round on emails a while ago and you could estimate how much you'd spent on alcohol in your life so far and predict if you carried on how much you'd fork out, and quite frankly, I have better things to spend my money on. Saying that, out of all of my friends, I do have the most well-stocked bar in my house for guests, it always gets a comment as visitors are shocked, but I like playing hostess with the mostess, and I like people to know I don't expect them to be like me (though of course this does not extend to having meat in the house!). I sometimes feel some people feel they can't completely relax and get drunk in front of me because they worry I am going to think they are a fool or a drunken monkey, or they'll do something they regret the next day and I'll remember it, but I've convinced anyone worried about this that this is just my choice, and I am not out to judge them. This is the right choice for me. I am happy. I also feel it's the most healthy way to be, and that appeals as well.

Snap, Antonia, sun-bathing is my little vice too. Well, we all need some lovely Vitamin D.

Aarinsky
Jul 10th, 2006, 03:30 AM
I do not drink alcohol. Why? Here’s a few reasons:
1.It’s toxic to every organ of the body. It can cause and contribute to myriad health problems.
2.Several studies have shown some health benefits to “moderate” consumption. There is reason to believe that these studies are flawed and/or biased. Even if there is some truth to the health claims, there are many other, safer ways of getting the same health benefits… i.e. eating right, exercise. The health benefits of red wine are mostly due to antioxidants in the red grapes, not the alcohol. Many foods contain these same compounds, but without the drawbacks of alcohol. (Pomegranates, red grapes, blueberries…)
3.It impairs cognition and judgment. It can lead to accidents, injuries, and deaths.
4.It makes people more rude and self-absorbed. It can lead to violence, crime, and broken relationships.
5.It can lead to psychological, and sometimes physical dependence. People often drink because they think they have to in order to be more “social” or to “have fun”, or because they give in to social pressure to do so. They continue to use it and rationalize it even when it becomes clear it’s becoming a harmful presence in their lives.
6.I’ve seen too many friends and loved ones be hurt by this drug. I don’t want to fall into the same trap, or support the industry that peddles this drug.
7.I’ve seen great improvement in health, physically and mentally, in myself and others after becoming a teetotaler.
8.It’s unnecessary. Alcohol provides no benefits that cannot be obtained more safely by other means.

Of course, everyone has to make their own choices in life. This is the choice I’ve made. I love the independence I get from abstaining from mind altering substances. I like being in control of my own life and treating my body and my mind right. I don’t want to gamble with my health and my mind by using drugs.

It can be tough to be a teetotaler in a culture that is so pro-alcohol. But you have to be true to yourself and your own choices in life and not let social pressures get you down.

berta_the_aspie
Jul 11th, 2006, 02:20 PM
how about marihuana and straight edge? probably not "allowed" but i dont see how it could be more bad/harmful than caffeine. and if the point of sXe is to not alter the mental state of mind as earlier mentioned, then its more of a religion i suppose...?
is marihuana "allowed" in veganism? it seems like a natural environmental substance, and animal friendly i think?
i have heard that tobacco and alcohol is worse than marihuana so im just thinking about it..
so which is "worse"?

Mr Flibble
Jul 11th, 2006, 02:25 PM
from a vegan perspective, if you consider humans to be animals then illegal drugs are worse than legal. Illegal drugs can never be deemed fair trade, when you buy them you have absolutely no idea of how many lives have been screwed up in order to bring it to you - or for that matter which organisations are generating revenue from your pocket. Then of course there's the fact that you have no idea of the purity or what they've been cut with (animal derived or not).

berta_the_aspie
Jul 11th, 2006, 02:48 PM
cut with?
oops, i meant if a vegan person is growing their own plants...

whalespace
Jul 12th, 2006, 08:18 AM
cut with?
oops, i meant if a vegan person is growing their own plants...

Hello Berta.
Cut with.... means mixed with. Sometimes drugs are laced with more addictive stuff or harmful chemicals.
Hemp grows wild all over the place, so you might find it by a river where anglers [fishers] have thrown their seed bait.
Like any herb, you should be careful if you make tea [an infusion] with it....although you could dilute it as much as you like.
Of course eating a plant is vegan but we must consider what happens when we ask strangers to supply things to us...what will they do to complete the deal?
:)
Is Mary Joanna a controlled substance in Norway?
Swapping alcohol for another drug might avoid certain problems specific to boozing, but will raise others.

berta_the_aspie
Jul 18th, 2006, 05:24 PM
"Swapping alcohol for another drug might avoid certain problems specific to boozing, but will raise others." huh? (im slow)
its controled yeah i suppose so. but i think it shud be legalized, alcohol is just sooo much worse...:(