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Last night I was working and was constantly assailed by the thought that as a vegan it was somehow my duty to go and visit a slaughterhouse (not that I think you can) and see how my beautiful fellow animals are killed to satisfy the palates of meat-eaters.
Naturally these thoughts disturbed me very much and I can't really understand why they came to me or how I should be feeling about such a dreadful concept.
Any thoughts? (Maybe I'm working too hard!!!)
I'd advise you not to.
unfortunately i have been in 2 slaughterhouses - also we have one slap bang next to the civic amenity here in the town. It is unavoidable sometimes to witness these things :mad:.
you probably could find some pretext for going into a slughterhouse if you really wanted to, but i wouldn't advise it, it would haunt you forever :undecided:.
Maybe, like you say, you really are over-working and a bit exhausted and frazzled :faint_smilie:.
I've seen footage of slaughterhouses and that's quite enough for me, I don't need to see the carnage first-hand. I know it would make me quite ill if I did.
You're doing your 'duty' to the animals by not exploiting them, fiamma, you don't need to witness the suffering caused to them by and for others.
Maybe you are working too hard and stressing yourself out Fiamma. :(
I don't subscribe to the view that vegans have to torture themselves watching Peta footage and animal testing videos to become more compassionate. You are already vegan and you know the reasons why. If people want to do it it's up to them but personally I wouldn't dream of doing it.
I saw a guy from my town (Peter Young, quite well known in animal liberation circles) who was jailed for freeing caged animals. He gave a talk and said that he does think that we should find our way in and see it first hand. He said it was after seeing it with his own eyes that he couldn't not dedicate his whole life and be willing to suffer anything to free the animals.
Why on earth would you want to traumatise yourself like that?Quote:
fiamma
Presumably if you're vegan you are already convinved enough about the horrors of the animal food industry.
You don't need to witness a murder to know murder is wrong.
In fact, if you traumatise yourself you're actually less capable of engaging the world in a positive way and making positive changes happen.
My advice: take some rest, get your mind straight and happy and then think about whether it's such a good idea or whether you aren't better off putting your compassion into action in other ways.
regards
I wouldn't go into one of those places in a million years. I am tortured enough by thoughts of what goes on there never mind witnessing it. I wake up suddenly during the night, quite frequently (like you do out of a nightmare) with the realisation that humans kill millions of animals every day and I can't stop them.
I just couldn't stand in one of those places and not do anything to save the animals..........I would have to intervene.........no matter how hopeless my efforts would be.
As vegans I don't think any of us have a duty to witness what goes on in there at all. If anything the people who have a duty to accept that they are animal killers, the meat eaters, are the ones who should feel an obligation to face the music (the reality and consequences of their diet choices).
I differ from many if not most here on this forum in that I like to know the grizzly details of what goes on so that in arguments with meat eaters I know what goes on better than they do and I have the upper hand. "Knowledge is power". To me it is like studying disease, war, crime, etc.; nasty stuff but important to understand and not bury one's head in the ground and just pretend they don't exist. Since I know I have nothing to do with these animal abuses/killings I of course feel zero guilt/shame/remorse. I don't gain this knowledge out of "obligation" but rather consider it just another weapon in my arsenal to combat meat eaters' specious claims. [Sorry, couldn't think of any non violent metaphors to describe what I meant.] This is just me, though, I'm not saying we all should feel the same.
Unfortunately for me I have no one on the planet to discuss these matters with as posting them here in our forum gets them banished to the hardly viewed "animal cruelty" members only section....I live in a vacuum.:(
Mahk surely you discuss these things with the people you are arming yourself to argue with?.
I don't look at the 'animal cruelty' section here because i can't take any more truth!. Like you, i try to avoid being vocal on matters i know nothing about, so i have done a lot of research myself, i don't want to talk about it anymore! (cos what good does that do unless it's talking to someone who doesn't already know? :confused:).
A bit off-topic but when i was shopping in Co-op today they were playing a recorded voice of a man telling customers that household products are routinely tested on animals, and how the Co-op works with B.U.A.V to produce cruelty free products. I was so cheered by this being played to everyone there that i felt guilty for being disloyal to Co-op since Tesco arrived. We are getting there, Fiamma, slowly but surely :thumbsup:.
Rarely. It is considered a sore subject to them and they will do almost anything possible to change the topic as quickly as possible. How many people will freely admit "Yes, I am a proud animal murderer and I have no qualms about it." Very few that I've come across. 99% of the populace can only eat meat because they disassociate having to take responsibility for animal murdering to do so. That's my estimation at least.Quote:
cobweb
I agree with Mahk and some others - if you ate meat etc it might be possible to argue that you ought to confront the consequences of your actions but as it is I can't see how you can possibly have a duty to visit a slaughterhouse, fiamma.
If you're anything like me it would probably make you feel depressed and discouraged so you can probably do more good without, IMO.
Exactly. If anyone has a duty to visit a slaughterhouse, it is those who eat the animals killed there. I wonder how many fewer omnivores there would be if everyone did this....
"If slaughterhouses had glass walls, everyone would be a vegetarian."
- Paul McCartney
me too.Quote:
gogs67
I was outside of a slaughterhouse once. The sounds were enough. :( I didn't cry but I just felt so sad, so empty. Like the feeling you get when you're at a funeral of a loved one.
I'd advise you not to go, especially if you're a sensitive type of person. It's absolutely horrible.
Ah, poor Paul, as naive a quote as i've heard!Quote:
Mahk
I wouldnt do it fiamma- just knowing what goes on in those places is bad enough, but to witness it would be horrifying.
I could never do it myself. I cry everytime I see a slaughter truck drive by me because I know where the poor babes are going.:sad:
I do think that ALL meat eaters should be made to go and see how the animals are kept and what happens in slaughterhouses. It would make them seriously re-evaluate their actions. :(
I
Fiamma, my opinion echoes many others on here. I wouldn't advise going to a slaughterhouse. You fulfill your duty to animals many times over by being a vegan. I think omnivores should be forced to go to a slaughterhouse since it's people like that who really need to see what goes on there. It sickens and saddens me to even think of the horrors that go on there. Witnessing those atrocities personally would drive me mad I think.
I understand why you're thinking about it Fiamma.
I don't think any vegans have a "duty" to visit a slaughterhouse, but I can understand why some might want to experience it first hand.
If you do choose to go, perhaps you could take a concealed video camera with you, to document what goes on. Or if you feel uncomfortable doing that, perhaps you could pose as a student who wants to take some footage for a project you are working on. I know someone who currently does that in an Asian country, for a large animal rights group.
Please don't go fiamma, we already know what tortures go on. I've seen a few dvds, but the last one I started to look at, 'Earthlings', I couldn't watch, it was too horrific. I'd like meat eaters to view it, but that won't happen, they say 'don't tell me about these things' - of course not, it might put them off their food!
The Paul McC's quote is really stupid - what about the people who actually do the killing? others who work there? It doesn't put them off, and I've seen footage where the killers tease the animals and cause them extra stress, just as some vivisection 'scientists' make fun of the animals they are experimenting on.
I feel awful :sad: I know you are all right and that I shouldn't go, and I've seen many pieces of footage from slaughterhouses, but it's a feeling from my heart that it's something I have to do... :( I think I'm going mad :(
I agree with what others have said, i.e. that really, meat eaters should have a duty to see what they are paying people to do, i.e. torture and kill sentient beings. They should make themselves aware of what they are paying people to do - same as any other business exchange really.
Also, I can understand that you might want to see it first hand, because then you will have absolutely no doubt about what routinely happens and nobody can ever deny you that personal experience. It may strengthen your resolve in the fight against evil!
Fiamma, if you do visit one of these places it might be the cause of you actually 'going mad'..........please be careful. I know I go into angry rages from time to time when I hear about or see cruelty to animals so I know if I was in one of those places I would physically hurt those who worked there.Quote:
fiamma
Religious people talk about 'Hell' as a place where you are supposed to burn for all eternity................my 'Hell' would be existing forever in a slaughter house.
I'm a big believer of "if you feel you need to do something then do it"Quote:
fiamma
I feel like i'm here to learn (summut, stuff, i'm not sure exactly why though) - and tend to make decisions that make me learn the hard way. But I never regret any of the ones I make because I felt like it was something I needed to do.
Don't rush into it though, and obviously I'm sure you are aware there will be serious aftereffects you will have to deal with if you decide to go.
But whatever you decide, I hope you get from it what you need :thumbsup:
What could Fiamma get from it though, that she 'needs'?
She's already vegan, she knows what goes on...........why torture yourself anymore?:confused:
How do you think you'd cope psychologically with witnessing at first hand what goes on in slaughterhouses? The sights, sounds and smells would stay with you for ever.Quote:
fiamma
That's not for me to decideQuote:
sandra
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green woman
that is for certain :no_expression:
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LGBunny
Maybe not LGBunny, but we all know there is nothing positive you could get from such an experience. :confused:
Not sure I agree, Sando.
It may strengthen one's resolve, thereby increasing the positive behaviours one exhibits.
Well I guess in that case you need to think really deeply about why you feel that need. Once you understand that, if you still think it is important and that you can cope with it psychologically, you should do it.Quote:
fiamma
(Speaking personally I can't imagine me getting any benefit out of such a visit, only a bigger sense of hopelessness.)
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Stu
I can't see how as vegans we need our resolve strengthened anymore than it already is. :confused:
Speaking personally, I am vegan for life.............it is who and what I am............being any other way would be alien for me. :)
I know I can only speak for myself here, so don't shout at me..............Stu! :D
I guess that is the sort of thing Stu might mean?Quote:
matt35mm
Isn't that the way all of us vegans feel though already?
Well I'm not dedicating my whole life to animal rights. I'm not willing to suffer anything to free the animals. I'm not out campaigning at every opportunity and I'm not willing to go to prison.
Is that just me?!
Some years ago I was asked to undertake an audit at an operational slaughterhouse and I considered accepting the task, just to see for myself.
Generally, I am very sceptical of what people tell me, I need to see/experience things for myself. I also felt I would be able to speak 'from experience' when convincing others of my plight.
I considered the opportunity seriously, but in the end declined and decided it was something I personally didnt have to experience to fully believe and therefore declined.
So, I can understand the 'need' to visit, people veiw things differently and the choice is a very personal/individual one.
I expect it would be a very distressing experience, so I would advise serious consideration of the possible effect it may have on you, compared to the benefits you may gain, before you make a decision.
It's not that I don't fully believe what goes on in slaughterhouses; I've seen enough footage to be quite convinced of what would await me.
It's more a case of making a connection with the animals taken there, almost as if it's not enough simply to abstain from eating meat, I feel I have to go there almost as if to give them some kind of strength, moral support as it were. Or perhaps it's a twisted way of easing my conscience, as if having been faced by the horros I can finally say I've done enough. But where does it all end? I dread to think...
Fiamma Vegan Warrior Extraordinaire.
Now I really am going to sound like a freak :sad:
If anything I think it would distress the animals more.............thinking for a fleeting moment that a human 'cared' for them and then being killed anyway.........it might help you Fiamma (although I don't think it would) but it certainly wouldn't 'help' the animals. :)
Nope, you're not alone. The majority of vegans aren't involved in that sort of activism.Quote:
Marrers
Personally, I do campaign and demonstrate quite a bit. I don't want to go to prison and I don't break the law. I don't want to be arrested or smacked with a truncheon, either, but unfortunately you don't have to break the law for the police to do either of those two.
So I'm willing to risk suffering abuse, violence and intimidation at the hands of the police, in the course of standing up for things I believe in (which includes protesting against animal abuse). But that is actually standing up for my own rights.
I don't think anyone else can make the decision for Fiamma - it is entirely up to you.
Personally, slaughterhouses are to me, just one of many things that are wrong with a world that puts financial gain ahead of human and animal welfare. If I spent all my time thinking of all the awful things that happen in the world then I think I would go mad. I think it is more useful to concern yourself with positive change and for me this means finding ways to change things politacally overall rather than concerning myself with single issues - like animal rights. Although at the moment, I am still trying to work out the best way to go about this!
fiamma, i can see it's a really difficult thing for you at the moment and i'm sorry to hear you're struggling with your feelings.
personally i could never bring myself to witness anything like that first-hand. the videos and mental pictures i have are horrific enough without going through it personally as well. i think seeing it in real life would be too traumatic for me and could actually cause me to feel more despair and grief than i do already, and would be counter-productive.
only you can decide what effect visiting a slaughterhouse would have on you but if you think there's any chance it could make you feel worse please don't risk it. your mental health is very important and you don't have a 'duty' to see these things. it's the people that still eat animals that need to see them.
please look after yourself. xxx
Wise words.Quote:
Gorilla