Taking B-12, stressed & suffering

**veganpixie** · Aug 29th, 2006, 12:00 AM

Hello dear vegan/vegetarian souls...
As the subject says, I'm severely stressed out and I feel like I'm losing my mind!!! *sobs* Sorry for the lengthy post, thank you in advance for reading it. *hugs* My husband and I have been happy healthy vegans for 10 years now, and we take vegan B-12 sublinguals regularly daily, sometimes, a double dosage if we're having a crisis, but it just doesn't feel like enough. Neither of us drinks any coffee or any caffeinated beverages, including soda. We don't consume any white refined sugar or corn syrup and we don't smoke or consume any alcohol. We're very careful about what we eat and we read ingredient labels very carefully for health reasons. We drink filtered or well water, juice, and soy milk. When we 1st went vegan we were so happy that we had made this choice, but no one warned us or told us about what happens when you become severely B-12 deficient and BOY did we find out the painful way!!! We were so bad we were shaking, our feet and legs were burning and our nerves and skin actually hurt and were sore. I was in tears and I felt like I was in hell!!!

Thank goodness it was recommended to us that we take B-12, Brewer's Yeast, and B-6!!! Today, we're still vegan, but not happy. I don't handle stress very well to begin with, so this added problem of having trouble finding healthy sources to coat my nerves is adding to it. My simple question is this. I am aware of the many wonderful protein sources available in the plant kingdom, such as avocado, cashews, almonds, tahini, and soy milk. The problem is that it just doesn't feel like it's adequate. I don't mind eating soaked nuts and seeds, but unless I can find a more economical source, cashews and almonds tend to be a bit pricey, especially in the organic health food store. I try to find them in economical Asian and similar stores. Is there a recipe I can make to mix something with tahini to make it "buttery flavor"-like? We use Earth Balance vegan buttery spread, but it hardly has any protein and it too is a bit pricey...we buy 1 or 2 a month. Once in a while I eat peanut butter, but I really don't like it and I gag if I'm not hungry for it.

Okay, that's all for now.

Thank you for being there and lending an ear. Please reply to me as soon as you can.

hugs and peace,
veganpixie

**Korn** · Aug 29th, 2006, 06:53 AM

Hi veganpixie,
it seems that you are assuming that your problems come from B12 or protein. First of all, protein deficiency is very rare, and if you search for threads with protein in the title, you'll find that there are many ways to get protein from plants.
Have you tested yourself for B12? If you have a severe B12 deficiency, which may be caused by a lot of reasons (eg. those mentioned here - and many others), you need to contact a doctor and have yourself tested for B12, MMA and homocysteine levels. I doubt that what you describe can be cured with a normal (or double) dose of B12 - there are many vegans that have been vegan longer than you, who hardly have taken any supplements, but who don't have the problems you describe.

There are various opinions about taking Brewer's Yeast in addition to B12, and B6 shouldn't be difficult to get from your diet. If you have a medical problem (which it sounds like, when you write about hurting/sore skin etc.) and even take B12 regularly, you need to consult a doctor, and find out what the real problem is. Some people think sublingual B12 isn't a good idea. Only a blood test can tell you if you're problem is related to B12 or not. If you have been low in B12 for too long, you may need a lot more than a double dose to get back to normal levels, and it may be possibly that you also have a B12 absorption problem (search the net for B12 absorption and intrinsic factor.)

There are many meat eaters, vegetarians and vegans that are low in B12, and unfortunately there are both doctors and nutritionists that say that you are safe if you take a normal amount of B12 daily, which may be a wrong and dangerous give advice to give, since so many people on various diets are low in B12.

Re.: tahini: you can use it in dressings, sauces, on bread, in hummus, in baba ganoush, and in combinations bean/lentil meals, which is seems (?) that you don't eat (or at least not mention) - legumes are normally great protein sources.

Human mother's milk normally contain 5-6% protein, and most, if not all, the foodstuff mentioned here should have 10% or more protein.

Some vegans believe that B12 deficiency isn't a problem for non-vegans, which is totally wrong, and may believe that they have good B12 levels when they start to eat vegan food. Several studies show 40% of average non-vegans have low B12 levels, so you may have started on a vegan diet 10 years ago with no or low B12 reserves.

Please remember that general advice on a forum can't substitute medical help, which is why I suggest seeing a doctor as soon as possible.

Good luck!

PygmyGoat · Sep 12th, 2006, 11:47 PM

How are you now, Veganpixie - I read your post with interest and wonder if you've had a B12 test yet?.

nervine · Mar 13th, 2007, 06:14 PM

Don't eat more than a handful of nuts a day. And only eat them at dinner and not together with sugary foods like dried fruits. Eat them after you've eaten fruit but before cooked starchy foods like potatos. Excess fat from nuts leads to toxification. Same with too much protein. The best sources of protein are from green leafy veggies like spinach, salad, parsley, etc.. They contain very little protein but from the best quality.

**harpy** · Mar 13th, 2007, 07:23 PM

nervine

Excess fat from nuts leads to toxification. Same with too much protein. The best sources of protein are from green leafy veggies like spinach, salad, parsley, etc.. They contain very little protein but from the best quality.

Where are you getting this information, please, nervine?

**Hemlock** · Mar 13th, 2007, 07:50 PM

Go for a blood test immediately!!! Vitamin B12 deficiency can cause irresversible nerve damage and cause you to lose sensation in your hands and feet permanently.
This is not something that can be dealt with using home remedies!
Make sure it is Vit B12 deficiency before jumping to any conclusions. I am an NHS nurse/podiatrist and I see vitamin B12 deficiency mostly in meat eaters, unfortunately I also see the end stage results where people have not got medical help early enough!

nervine · Mar 13th, 2007, 07:53 PM

harpy

Where are you getting this information, please, nervine?

http://www.sendspace.com/file/mxky2l

**harpy** · Mar 13th, 2007, 09:00 PM

nervine

http://www.sendspace.com/file/mxky2l

Thanks, but is there any scientific evidence (i.e. in a peer-reviewed journal) that you can get enough protein from green leafy vegetables? I would be interested to know the life expectancy of those folk in New Guinea and so on.

I agree though that most omnivores probably get more protein than they need.

nervine · Mar 13th, 2007, 09:39 PM

harpy

Thanks, but is there any scientific evidence (i.e. in a peer-reviewed journal) that you can get enough protein from green leafy vegetables? I would be interested to know the life expectancy of those folk in New Guinea and so on.

I agree though that most omnivores probably get more protein than they need.

I don't know and I'm not saying you can get enough protein from just green leafy veg but it's a very important type of veg to include in a raw diet or in any diet/lifestyle for that matter. That tribe ate mainly sweet potatoes which has also very high quality protein that's very easily absorbed.