Results 1 to 41 of 41

Thread: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Sydney Australia
    Posts
    67

    Default Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Just wondered if any Aussies saw the Sunday paper front page article "Soy Linked with Cancer"? The article was written by the Cancer Council (so a reliable source) and was basically saying that people with cancer should avoid soy products because excessive amounts have been shown to feed tumours. I felt by 'excessive' they meant people who were eating several serves of soy a day and taking soy supplements and concluded that 'moderation' was the key here. It kind of reminded me of the HRT scare some years ago which was totally taken out of context - and I wondered why the cancer council have never put out an article about the use of dairy products and their link with breast/ovarian cancer (to my knowledge anyway). Just wondered if anyone else saw the article and if so, what is your opinion on it?

  2. #2
    I eve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    2,210

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Hi Woodsie, yes, couldn't help reading the article when it was splashed all over the front page of the Sunday Mail. I posted about it at http://www.veganforum.com/forums/sho...soy#post269858

    As for my opinion, I find it really annoying that so many articles from so-called authorities tell women in particular to drink plenty of milk to avoid conditions such as osteoporosis, when we all know that ingesting dairy products actually helps bring about osteo. It's obvious that the Dairy Board, as well as the Meat Board, are powerful lobbies. It is actually all a matter of the bottom line - which media outlets are going to print articles about the dangers of milk and meat when their advertising income is so dependent upon meat and dairy? Just about everything that's advertised is a milk/meat product, whether the ads are on tv or in magazines, or in newspapers. Sickening
    Eve

  3. #3
    I eve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    2,210

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Now is revealed that the people in this 'research' are all advanced cancer patients that were put onto heavy phytoestrogen supplements. But of course by now, the general public remember the main article, and don't understand the rest.
    Eve

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Sydney Australia
    Posts
    67

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Hi Eve .... where did you see this article? Was it in the paper? I didn't get round to reading it.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    All this "soy causes cancer" stuff is really odd to me (I'm no expert, so perhaps the science is "beyond" me) but soy contains IP6, which is a tumor suppressant, so logically you'd think soy would help fight cancer. Sigh. Things are never so simple.

    Having said that, I'd rather live with the health problems supposedly associated with soy, than the health problems definitely associated with meat.

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    126

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote karmadust View Post

    Having said that, I'd rather live with the health problems supposedly associated with soy, than the health problems definitely associated with meat.
    Agreed.

  7. #7
    Not Giving Up Pisces's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Moving forward in life
    Posts
    270

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote karmadust View Post

    Having said that, I'd rather live with the health problems supposedly associated with soy, than the health problems definitely associated with meat.
    I agree too!

  8. #8
    I eve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    2,210

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote Woodsie View Post
    Hi Eve .... where did you see this article? Was it in the paper? I didn't get round to reading it.
    In either the "Weekend Australian" or the "Sunday Mail" that I read this last weekend, there were a couple of 'advertorials' by Sanitarium and another soymilk manufacturer. Both their half-page ads clearly pointed out the facts about the original claim that soy leads to cancer. But as I posted, the general public would remember the first article - cosidering it had full front page banner headlines etc rather than the announcements by Sanitarium and the other firm.
    Eve

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Sydney Australia
    Posts
    67

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Yes .. my sister was gleefully pointing out the article in the paper. Wonder why people have to do that? Gee, there's a zillion articles linking meat and dairy to ill health that I could rub their noses in if I chose to!

  10. #10
    Not Giving Up Pisces's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Moving forward in life
    Posts
    270

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    I know! Anything that's non-vegan seems to give non-vegans the impression that they have justification for their cruel doings/unhealthy living. When we (vegans) abstain from rubbing their noses into veganfriendly articles, well, that often makes them (the non-vegans) seem more idiotic on their part (choosing to rub our noses when we don't do so to them, despite potentially being tempted to). Does that make any sense?

  11. #11

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Sydney Australia
    Posts
    67

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Definitely! For some reason their thinking is 'majority rules' if you get my drift ... i.e. if the majority are meat eaters then it must be ok, like, people have always eaten meat and dairy so they can't be bad for us. I guess we have all been brainwashed by the meat and dairy corporations which is further reinforced by dietitions, heart/cancer foundations endorsing many of these 'foods'. It is only those of us who have broadened our knowledge on these issues and made the 'connection' with animal rights and health benefits who have seen the light. They just like to say "I told you so" - guess that makes them feel in their own minds that it's ok to eat animal products. Hope that makes some sort of sense!

  12. #12

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Sounds misleading. There is a difference between soy foods (soy beans, tofu, tempeh, soy milk, etc) and soy protein isolates (mock meats, soy protein shakes and other heavily refined/altered foods. I quickly skimmed over the information from the cancer council, and they endorse soy foods while frowning on isolated soy protein. Rightfully so, but misleading information reported by the press.

    When dealing with people who use this to discredit a vegan diet. Try to remember that we eat a plant-based diet, and not a soy-based one.

  13. #13
    Not Giving Up Pisces's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Moving forward in life
    Posts
    270

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Good find, Fifty9! That is a difference. I can't bring myself to eat/crave mock meats because they remind me of the corpses that they're imitating (if you know what I mean).

    And Woodsie, I know exactly what you mean. You're making plenty of sense.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Mock meats are not healthy, even if they are vegan. People would do well to avoid them, or limit them to special occasions. Tofurky on Thanksgiving is fine, but mixing vegie-ground into your spaghetti sauce every week is not a good idea. A lot of the protein related problems associated with eating meat are also found with eating isolated soy protein.


    Tofu would be a better choice, but it's still better to consume tofu as a condiment with a meal rather than the main course.

  15. #15
    I eve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    2,210

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Pisces, you say:
    I can't bring myself to eat/crave mock meats because they remind me of the corpses that they're imitating (if you know what I mean).
    Sure do know what you mean. I was in a vegan restaurant in Sydney a few years back, and the waiter brought out a tray to a nearby table, with what appeared to be a huge fish on a platter. Of course it was imitation, but the look of it was quite revolting to me!
    Eve

  16. #16
    Not Giving Up Pisces's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Moving forward in life
    Posts
    270

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Geez! I would have reacted the same way. I'm glad I'm not the only one who reacts to such analogs that way!

    And, Woodsie, I agree that tofu is better as a condiment than a main meal (that goes for all proteins in my opinion). Of course, if they're vegan (real) proteins, that's the only kinds of protein (tofu, other forms of soy) one should get, but it shouldn't be so overrated (e.g. the only source of protein). One would have to eat nothing but something with no nutritional value in order to be deficient in protein (something that many non-vegans are sadly mislead by).

  17. #17
    AR Activist Roxy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    4,977

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote Fifty9 View Post
    Mock meats are not healthy, even if they are vegan. People would do well to avoid them, or limit them to special occasions. Tofurky on Thanksgiving is fine, but mixing vegie-ground into your spaghetti sauce every week is not a good idea. A lot of the protein related problems associated with eating meat are also found with eating isolated soy protein.


    Tofu would be a better choice, but it's still better to consume tofu as a condiment with a meal rather than the main course.

    But I thought that there were some companies that didn't use soy protein isolates. Tofurky for example claims not to use these (I am particularly thinking of their deli-slices, sausages and Tofurky roast). I also notice on Yves packaging that they list soy protein and soy protein isolates as 2 separate ingredients.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    I don't think Tofurky uses them, but my basic point being that soy foods that are so rich in protein should not be eaten on a regular basis. I think Tofurky has over 25g of protein per serving, which is really high. Yves and Light Life I'm sure use isolates.

    What happens is that these protein isolates greatly increase the IGF-1 levels in our blood. IGF-1 is a growth hormone that promotes cell growth while inhibiting cell death. This creates an environment in your body that is perfect for cancer growth, but terrible for your lifespan. Meat doesn't seem to increase IGF-1 levels, but milk does. However, soy protein isolates increase IGF-1 levels by a percentage nearly double that of milk.

    The studies I've seen do not link simple soy foods to cancer, only isolates where all of the fiber and nutrients have been removed. Some ingredients to look out for would be; isolated soy protein, soy protein concentrate, soy concentrate, textured vegetable protein, textured soy flour and defatted soy flour.

  19. #19
    AR Activist Roxy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    4,977

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Oh wow - Ok - thanks so much for the info! I actually do eat a lot of faux meat products. Errrr......maybe I need to slow down!

  20. #20

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    I use to eat them a lot too in the beginning, but I feel so much better when I stay away from the stuff. After Thanksgiving when I eat Tofurky/Unturky, I feel terrible and sluggish for two days! I just do much better when I eat a baked potato and kale for dinner.

  21. #21
    AR Activist Roxy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    4,977

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Hehe - I'm 2 years into my veganism though lol. One of the first things I'm going to do is check on the ingredients before I purchase any more of these products.

  22. #22

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    If being vegan is a life-long decision, then the two-year mark would still be at the beginning for you. So, good job!

    You respond really fast, by the way... It's like telepathy.

  23. #23
    AR Activist Roxy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    4,977

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Yes, I'm a vegan toddler

    How quick was that

  24. #24

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    two minutes. What took you so long?

  25. #25
    AR Activist Roxy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    4,977

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    checking ingredients

  26. #26
    frugivorous aubergine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Orbiting London
    Posts
    1,474

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote Fifty9 View Post
    The studies I've seen do not link simple soy foods to cancer, only isolates where all of the fiber and nutrients have been removed. Some ingredients to look out for would be; isolated soy protein, soy protein concentrate, soy concentrate, textured vegetable protein, textured soy flour and defatted soy flour.
    I'm still sceptical. Have you read the china study? The way Dr Campbell explains proteins 'feed' cancer doesn't tally with some of the other studies that point to soy proteins. The china study was done on an unprecedented scale and deals with people who consume a lot of those soy based products and have little or no cancer evident.

    I found this video explains some of what he found very well.

  27. #27

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    John Robbins also addresses the "dangers" of soy on his website, The Food Revolution. You might want to check it out, as he discusses some of the points made in this thread (about soy isolates, etc).
    When you are guided by compassion and loving-kindness, you are able to look deeply into the heart of reality and see the truth.--Thich Nhat Hanh

  28. #28

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    126

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote Roxy View Post
    Oh wow - Ok - thanks so much for the info! I actually do eat a lot of faux meat products. Errrr......maybe I need to slow down!

    I like faux meats, too, Roxy. I have found some terrific ones at my local asian supermarket-but I have tried to limit them to once a week or less. Otherwise, my favorite soy treat is cold tofu with asian dumpling sauce.

  29. #29

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote vegandrummersam View Post
    I'm still sceptical. Have you read the china study? The way Dr Campbell explains proteins 'feed' cancer doesn't tally with some of the other studies that point to soy proteins. The china study was done on an unprecedented scale and deals with people who consume a lot of those soy based products and have little or no cancer evident.

    I found this video explains some of what he found very well.
    Yes, I own a copy of the China study. It's important to understand the difference between simple soy foods such as soy milk, tofu, tempeh and others where the soy is converted by simple means. Boiling, grinding, fermenting, etc. Isolates are very different, in that every recognizable part of the soy bean has been removed leaving only the protein. This was never the way it was intended to be consumed, especially when human protein requirements (minimum) for the average-active adult are only about 2.5% of calories.

    Soy isolates are no longer soy, just the way high fructose corn syrup is no longer corn.

    Also, the people of China don't eat soy in the amounts that Westerners do. You have to look at the total diet; rice and lots of vegetables.

  30. #30
    John's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    NJ USA
    Posts
    714

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    I wonder if whatever chemical it is that furthers the cancer is present in meat since 90% of the world's soy goes to feed livestock. I wouldn't be suprised if it were against the law to print that it is. And I didn't even know there were scientists in Australia.

  31. #31
    AR Activist Roxy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    4,977

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote John View Post
    And I didn't even know there were scientists in Australia.

    Is that a joke?

  32. #32
    John's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    NJ USA
    Posts
    714

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Well, now that the crocodile hunter died, are there any left?

  33. #33

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    There have been some very important scientific papers to come out of Australia. This one for example on the studies of genetic similarities between koala bears and dolphins.




    Fascinating...

  34. #34

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    ^ I'm just kidding...

  35. #35
    AR Activist Roxy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    4,977

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote John View Post
    Well, now that the crocodile hunter died, are there any left?

    I'll take it you're joking.

  36. #36
    campbell Campbell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    56

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Personally I don't much like any soy products (and tried many kinds), but there's a widespread assumption amongst omnis that because I'm vego therefore I live on tofu. If people actually like the taste, then go for it, I'm happy to believe soy is pretty healthy, in moderation. It's certainly no more harmful than the junk most people eat. A lot of omnis don't realise how much soy they eat anyway, in processed bread and sausage rolls for example.
    But I think we should eat the foods we enjoy, and we don't have to eat soy to be healthy vegans. There is such a huge variety of nuts, fruits, grains, etc. I don't eat a huge amount of protein myself, because my body tells me I feel healthier without it. From what I've heard, Pythagoras held the opinion that beans of any kind are bad for us - he was a bit kooky, and I don't necessarily agree with him. Different people function best on different foods. I know that I don't like beans much and feel better when I avoid them. I do love apples though.

  37. #37

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    I have met several vegans who think they need to eat a brick of tofu everyday just to meet their protein requirements. I like a little 'fu now and again, but there's plenty of protein in starches, vegetables and fruits to meet and exceed our requirements.

  38. #38
    mjj48's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Barking
    Posts
    35

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Just finished watching that speech on the link further up the thread. Fascinating stuff, some very interesting points raised.

    Loved the bit about the study recommending we consume 25% of our calories from sugars such as sweets etc being funded by the M&M and Mars company lol.

  39. #39
    sizeT
    Guest

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote Woodsie View Post
    Just wondered if any Aussies saw the Sunday paper front page article "Soy Linked with Cancer"? The article was written by the Cancer Council (so a reliable source)
    I would like to say people that do studies are the ones benifiting from it.. no source is reliable.

  40. #40
    baffled harpy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    6,655

    Smile Soy linked with NOT getting cancer

    http://news.independent.co.uk/health/article3233324.ece

    Must say I'm surprised they can get anything soy up Mount Athos. I wonder what it is?

  41. #41

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    London, UK
    Posts
    51

    Default Re: Soy Linked with Cancer Article

    Quote Pisces View Post
    Good find, Fifty9! That is a difference. I can't bring myself to eat/crave mock meats because they remind me of the corpses that they're imitating (if you know what I mean).

    And Woodsie, I know exactly what you mean. You're making plenty of sense.
    Thanks, Pisces, for bring up the issue of so-called 'mock meats'. I'm not sure that coagulated soya protein and gluten (or combination of both) actually taste like animal corpses (its over 30 years since I have eaten animal flesh). I have to say that I do like the taste and texture of vegan sausages, etc. but sometimes have some qualms about this. I cannot envisage a situation in my life where, even if there were an extreme shortage of soya protein isolate and gluten products (why should there be - its almost like the "would you eat meat if you were marooned on a desert island scenario) that I would contemplate eating meat or dairy again.

    Clearly such foods are bona-fide vegan. They are not meat and avoid animal cruelty and exploitation, combat human hunger and safeguard the planet and its resources. Seitan (wheat-meat) in particular is a very ancient vegan food invented/discovered millennia ago by vegetarian monks in Tibet and many contemporary vegan so called 'mock meats' (the name is quite offensive I find) are seitan with the addition of soya isolate. I do not believe that the taste of such products duplicate that of animal flesh. Even if this were the case it would mean that no-one would have any conceivable excuse for eating meat as traditional flavours could be reproduced directly from plants without animal abuse or jeopardising the future of the planet. This in itself could lead to an exponential growth of veganism in a relatively short space of time, which is what we need if environmental catastrophe to the biosphere is to be avoided.

    I suppose at the end of the day I am concerned about a possible cancer link with consumption of soya protein isolate (although I do fully acknowledge that there is a full-on propaganda war between the powerful 'meat and dairy' lobby and manufacturers and consumers of soya - such as vegans). On a lesser note I am also concerned that for some of my fellow vegans I am less 'authentically' vegan than others who do not eat soya protein isolate and gluten products. I suppose on the other hand seitan, in particular has as ancient a lineage as a vegan staple as bread.

    I'd be really glad to hear of other people's views on this. At the end of the day I suppose I am quite a lazy cook as soya protein and gluten foods are readily available in chilled and frozen forms, which fits into a busy lifestyle. I do cook other vegan protein foods based on nuts and beans and also tofu, another particular favourite based on 'altered' soya, but would find life more complicated without my meatless, eggless and dairyless sausages, schnitzels, etc. And Redwood Foods make a vegan bacon to die for!!

Similar Threads

  1. Diseases linked to proximity to animals, not just eating them
    By soilman in forum Animal products and health risks
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: May 21st, 2010, 02:24 PM
  2. Replies: 2
    Last Post: Jan 9th, 2007, 10:04 AM
  3. Bad air linked to cancer-causing gene changes in fetuses
    By 1vegan in forum Human evolution and environmental issues
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: Feb 23rd, 2005, 07:15 AM
  4. Weight gain linked to dementia
    By eve in forum VEGAN HEALTH
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: Feb 23rd, 2005, 12:35 AM

Tags for this thread (If you see one or more tags below, click on them if you're looking for similar threads!)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •