View Poll Results: Male circumcision: yes or no?

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  • Yes to circumcision of male babies/children

    20 10.47%
  • No to circumcision of male babies/children

    171 89.53%
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Thread: Circumcision or no circumcision?

  1. #151
    Yoggy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Heartsease View Post
    Guys can keep clean without bein' mutilated.
    I think if I was a circumcised guy, I would be insulted that my parents considered me so incapable of practicing good hygiene that they cut part of my penis off.
    "Man can do as he wills, but not will as he wills" - Arthur Schopenhauer

  2. #152
    Va'amish Heartsease's Avatar
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    Unhappy Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Anyone fancy having all teeth removed instead of simply cleaning them?
    Butt, I think the reasons the 'tradition' began are varied and may include (I think I saw in earlier post) the attempt to prevent masturbation.
    Doing something because it is 'traditional' is the lamest excuse of all.
    Sorry, Iym having a bad night....
    I am trying to be understanding and non-judgemental. Apologies! I just feel children and animals are subject to all sorts of crap and that we should challenge all harm that needlessly befalls them because they (unlike most adults) can seldom do so themselves.
    "You can discover more about a person in one hour of play than in a year of conversation" ~ Plato

  3. #153
    Manzana Manzana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I agree to do it to a baby without consent is not good... but if they choose to have it done later on in life I see no problem...
    a question to those women so against it (sorry guys!)... have you been with a circumcised man to be able to compare? was the experience bad/worse? In my LIMITED experience, hygiene is a lot better (and no, before you ask I dont have any problems with uncircumcised guys either, I am just trying to be objective here)

  4. #154
    baffled harpy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I've encountered both varieties in my (ahem) long career, though admittedly not in great numbers, and all were scrupulously clean I'm pleased to report

  5. #155
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I don't normally do this but LOL! at harpy

  6. #156
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Manzana View Post
    ...
    a question to those women so against it (sorry guys!)... have you been with a circumcised man to be able to compare? was the experience bad/worse? In my LIMITED experience, hygiene is a lot better (and no, before you ask I dont have any problems with uncircumcised guys either, I am just trying to be objective here)
    I haven't got a huge sample, but I wouldn't say I've been with any uncircumcised people who made me think "phew, this is a bit niffy, I think they should get that bit of skin lopped off" and I've tended to think that uncircumcised is more comfortable/feels more lubricated.

  7. #157
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Manzana View Post
    have you been with a circumcised man to be able to compare?
    Yes. There was no difference for me. Just because a man is circumcised doesn't mean he won't smell if he doesn't wash correctly!
    "Do what you can with what you have where you are."
    - Theodore Roosevelt

  8. #158
    Ex-admin Korn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Heartsease View Post
    Anyone fancy having all teeth removed instead of simply cleaning them?
    I will not eat anything that walks, swims, flies, runs, skips, hops or crawls.

  9. #159
    Va'amish Heartsease's Avatar
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    Red face Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Manzana View Post
    a question to those women so against it (sorry guys!)... have you been with a circumcised man to be able to compare?)
    Mr Peeled-Banana got uncomfortable when he cycled because he had no 'protection' over his sensitive spots and his clothing rubbed.

    I had read some research about the effects of male circumcism on the female partners ability to orgasm (during vaginal sex)...this research suggested that the foreskin aids female orgasm because the (ahem) 'helmet' will pull out moisture when the penis exits the vagina...whereas an intact penis will leave the helmet covered on the way out reducing moisture loss.


    Butt (and it's a hairy one! ) the fact that Mr Peeled-Banana was/is far yummier than Mr Unpeeled (in my opinion) is owing to Mr Peeled-Banana's high standards of cleanliness and gentle nature not because part of his body was surgically removed to satisfy someone else's preconceived notions.
    "You can discover more about a person in one hour of play than in a year of conversation" ~ Plato

  10. #160

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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I've been with both and there were no problems with hygiene. Circumcised men cant masturbate without lubrication.

  11. #161
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Here's a graphical explanation why circumcised sex harms women: http://www.sexasnatureintendedit.com/
    Die Schnecken sind meine Freunden!

  12. #162
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote hazelbunny View Post
    Circumcised men cant masturbate without lubrication.
    I can tell you first-hand that that is not true.


    Cheers,
    rant
    "Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter." --Yoda

  13. #163
    Manzana Manzana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Toro Rosso View Post
    Here's a graphical explanation why circumcised sex harms women: http://www.sexasnatureintendedit.com/
    Maybe there is some science in the theory but I am going to have to disagree in practice

  14. #164
    Va'amish Heartsease's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?


    I also disagree in practise...butt...(and I'm quotin' a smart-arse) unless we're prepared to do a 'proper' study...ie. Have sex with 100 of each our 'research' is not conclusive.
    "You can discover more about a person in one hour of play than in a year of conversation" ~ Plato

  15. #165

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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote rantipole View Post
    I can tell you first-hand that that is not true.


    Cheers,
    rant
    Oh ok! Must be down to the individual..

  16. #166
    Manzana Manzana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Heartsease View Post

    I also disagree in practise...butt...(and I'm quotin' a smart-arse) unless we're prepared to do a 'proper' study...ie. Have sex with 100 of each our 'research' is not conclusive.
    Fair point... I guess I am not preparedto do a "proper"study

  17. #167
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Manzana View Post
    have you been with a circumcised man to be able to compare? was the experience bad/worse? In my LIMITED experience, hygiene is a lot better (and no, before you ask I dont have any problems with uncircumcised guys either, I am just trying to be objective here)
    My only close encounter with the uncircumcised kind was a partner I had when I was 13. In fact, growing up in America, I have only ever known three uncut guys. (@_@)

    Yeah, he tasted and smelled mildly different, but nonetheless yummy. (^_^)
    Unfortunately, he was very shy about letting me really see and explore it, so he would only let me be intimate with him in the dark and nearly always wanted to enter me from behind. So I've received most all of my /visual/ experience of the uncut penis through photography.
    /Seeing/ the difference does not make me think, "eww" or "eh..". Rather, it makes me feel tingly and like a little girl, again- very curious and eager to explore.

    I cannot fathom how anyone could find it ugly, undesirable, or unclean. The only experience I had with a unclean penis was with a diff partner I went down on after he had been skateboarding for a few hours.
    Now /that/ was unpleasant and goes to the reasoning that cleanliness is a determining factor in penile hygiene, while the presence of a foreskin is not.

    Don't get me wrong... I love the circumcised penis, as well, and would never reject a guy based on the fact that he had been cut. There is no reason for circumcised males to be embarrassed or feel sexually inadequate, cause I can assure you that is not the case, yet I can understand if there is a small /personal/ feeling of loss.

    Bottomline... I really do feel deeply that circumcision (outside of medical necessity) is just sick and wrong.

  18. #168
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I think the term "foreskin" is extremely misleading, and serves to perpetuate a lack of understanding. I think many people view it simply as extra skin that can be sloughed off without consequence.

    For the females who are having trouble identifying with or understanding what is lost to circumcision, try for a moment to imagine living without your labia and clitoral hood. (I realize that the clitoral hood, alone, is homologous to the foreskin, but since (a) we have the extra cover/protection and mucocutaneous flesh of the labia, and (b) there are similarities between nerve receptors in the labia and foreskin,... I think the effect of circumcision can be better understood by removal of both.)

    So gone is your labia and those receptors to touch and heat they contain. If you have ever played with the stimulation of warmth and cold to your inner and outer labia or even just had the wet warmth of a mouth/tongue there, then you know how far these sensors and consequent sensations can take you. Circumcision does not remove all of these receptors, but I think the loss of any at all sis reason to mourn.

    The deliciously sensitive tip (glans) of the penis is not as responsive as your clitoris (since we have more nerve endings there and many many more per area, as they are located very close together in what is a much smaller package , but it /is/ the second most sensitive part of human (both male and female) anatomy, and is therefore comparable. Your clitoris would not have the soft, fleshy protection of the lips & the clitoral hood to keep it moist & fully encased, away from friction and other irritants. It would be rubbed against by the material of your panties, pants, chairs, benches, bike seats, etc., resulting in discomfort, pain, and eventual desensitization.
    The lack of moisture, protecting from the harsh exposure to air would result in a hardening of the flesh, called keritazation (keritan being what "water-proofs" and, essentially toughens the outer layer of skin, absent on eyes, clits, glans...) . It is the same thing that would happen to eyeballs, if you were to remove the lid and the same thing that happens to the head of circumcized penises (to varying degrees)... resulting in further desensitization.

    None of this is to say that the circumcised male does not benefit from the pleasures of sexual stimuli. Of course, we all know that he does. I am just saying that there is medical evidence (in addition to common sense) that suggests that the physical sensation in response to sexual stimuli is lessened, to an unknown extent. Why, then, would anyone want to, voluntarily, do this to another human being (let alone their own child), once they are presented with the facts?

    Would you want your labia taken, with or without your consent, because it was determined that without the damp, warm environment it presents, there is less likelihood for the harboring of bacteria, yeast, sexually-transmitted infection,etc. and it would be easier to clean?
    No, thanks.

    And could you ever justify slicing off your daughter's labia or clitoral hood for these reasons?

  19. #169
    Manzana Manzana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Just a point, I never said that circumcision is a justifiable act or better for men.

    It is obvious that cutting a part of your body at random is not very natural. There are, however, cases where it is necessary and as long as the individual is a consenting male, I see no reason to think of it as sick (a different case is when it is done to male babies just because their parents think it looks better/it's healthier)...

    saying that, in my limited experience, hygiene does seem to be better (which again, is not to say that it is justifiable or a good thing to do)

  20. #170
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I can tell you that as an uncircumcised adult male, I would never do it now. While living in America, I heard of men that had undergone surgery, but their reasoning seemed all wrong as it was due to a perceived (social pressure) notion that uncircumcised men were not as attractive or clean ... I would be careful not to perpetuate such stereotypes, but I could be all wrong ... Perhaps the anglo-saxon ideal includes a man that has a dick without a foreskin
    Die Schnecken sind meine Freunden!

  21. #171
    Manzana Manzana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I know a couple of circumcised adult males that are quite happy with their choice and I don't think that in the UK (or Spain) there is ANY kind of social pressure (unless you are from certain religious background). Also, I don't think that aesthetically one choice is better than the other, I was just making a point on why some people prefer circumcised to not.

  22. #172
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    You obviously like cut dicks Manzana, I get your point (uncut dicks are not as clean), but you make it sound like this is no big deal (as the couple of adult males 'happy' with their guilt-free choice would testify for you) ...

    This is off-topic, but the other thing I noticed in the UK is that people hide their true beliefs behind a mask of politeness, I was going to start a different thread on this topic ...
    Die Schnecken sind meine Freunden!

  23. #173
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    A mans right to choose but why not leave it as you find it if it functions ok that way. Quite frankly, I think they're lovely whatever. That Frank enough for you Toro Rosso. And I'm English!! :-O
    If i keep a green bough in my heart my singing bird will come.

  24. #174
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I meant no offense, I really like the English, you just have a hard time getting things off your chest sometimes ...

    Anyways, I really think there is no way a healthy non-denominational adult male would undergo circumcision surgery, and risk all the complications that come with it, if it weren't for social pressure. I would like to hear an opinion to the contrary.
    Die Schnecken sind meine Freunden!

  25. #175
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Why are people discussing which is better for sex??? As an expert on the female species, I know what is really important to women. Big and hard. That's all. Nothing more.

  26. #176
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Hard, yes. Big, no.

    I can't really tell if you're joking, John. If you're not, you should look at the ton of info out there about women's perception of the male penis, and they all conclude the same thing: we don't care about size. This is from an article I read earlier:

    "Any woman reading this article may find it puzzling that so many men are concerned about the length of their penis"

    "No matter how often it's written that penile size doesn't matter, and that women aren't attracted to a man because of the length of his organ, the average male continues to think the same way."
    "Man can do as he wills, but not will as he wills" - Arthur Schopenhauer

  27. #177
    Manzana Manzana's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Toro Rosso View Post
    You obviously like cut dicks Manzana, I get your point (uncut dicks are not as clean), but you make it sound like this is no big deal (as the couple of adult males 'happy' with their guilt-free choice would testify for you) ...

    This is off-topic, but the other thing I noticed in the UK is that people hide their true beliefs behind a mask of politeness, I was going to start a different thread on this topic ...
    First, I might slightly prefer cut but it is not something I feel that strongly about (i.e. I do not think it is a big deal as long as there is consent) For the time being I am enjoying "cut" and I was quite surprised to see that much opposition in this thread.

    Second, I have no problem talking openly about my true believes. I am quite straight forward and open and if you are suggesting that this is a "british thing", you'll be glad to know that I am 100% spanish and have only lived in the UK for a few years so your theory does not apply.

  28. #178
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Yoggy View Post
    I can't really tell if you're joking, John.
    I'm sure he's joking. After all, he said he was an expert when it comes to women. No man is.
    "Do what you can with what you have where you are."
    - Theodore Roosevelt

  29. #179

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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Toro Rosso View Post

    This is off-topic, but the other thing I noticed in the UK is that people hide their true beliefs behind a mask of politeness, I was going to start a different thread on this topic ...

    I think you are right, but we do it so everyone gets along better. Otherwise, people would be arguing all day long!

  30. #180
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I think it depends on the environment. I'm very honest with my freinds but might be more mindful with work colleague or those I didn't know well. I see no reason for politeness on this board though and if I bother to say something on a topic it is honest.
    Idleness is not doing nothing. Idleness is being free to do anything. - Floyd Dell

  31. #181

    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Wash, don't amputate.
    As for the higher HIV susceptibility, it shouldn't make a difference should it because we're using condoms if we're unsure. Right? Right?

    P.S Another plus:
    My nob is way more sensitive than a circumcised guy's apparently. TMI, I know.

  32. #182
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    if you are an older fella then it is an advantage for you but without a 100% stiffy then the additional tissue flapping about puts the lady at a distinct disadvantage.

    if you are a young stud then a degree less sensitivity could help the fun last more than 30 seconds....
    the only animal ingredient in my food is cat hair

  33. #183
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I don't think sensitivity has much to do with how long guys last, it's a lot more to do with their state of mind. My last bf was circumcised, but so underconfident that he lasted about 30 seconds (TMI, I know). My current bf is uncircumcised and he can literally go for hours without stopping (way too much info LOL )
    "Man can do as he wills, but not will as he wills" - Arthur Schopenhauer

  34. #184
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    If I ever have a male child, I will let him stay intact unless he has a serious medical problem that requires it. I really don't think it would be my place to make that kind of decision about my child's body.
    Quote Risker View Post
    Likewise I think it's terrible when I see babies with pierced ears - Children are not their parents property and shouldn't be allowed to damage their bodies for their own vanity.
    Since this is somewhat related, I felt I'd make a quick(ish) response: I 100% agree with this. Although I personally love piercings, I was pierced at two months old and I believe it was unfair of my parents to do that to me. My two younger sisters did not have their ears pierced and I'm glad of it because they dislike piercings of all types and, after years of having your ears pierced, they're kind of impossible to close up. Just as with circumcision, they can't exactly tape foreskin back on if they decide as adults that they like the look of uncut penises more.

  35. #185
    Mahk
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Actually there is a form of reversal; google the word "epispasm".

  36. #186
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Mahk View Post
    Actually there is a form of reversal; google the word "epispasm".
    I'd rather my future-would-be-son not have to go through /that/, either.

  37. #187
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I don't think it matters a whole lot either way. Some people think circumcision is a good way to preventing bacteria, but I think if you have good hygeine this shouldn't be a problem at all.

    Aside from Jewish people, I really don't understand why people would feel the need to circumcise their children at all. Maybe there's some good reasons I don't know about. I haven't read through this thread yet so maybe there's some ideas in there.

  38. #188
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Well, I posted about circumcision on the masturbation thread, and I stuck to my guns because I felt it was a masturbation issue that my ex had been circumcised as an infant and thus had a hard time coming. In fact, all the scar tissue (which occasionally becomes inflamed) that the circumcision left desensitizes the head, and because the glans is exposed, it rubs against his pants. How natural is this?

    I'm past the age at which I'll ever have to make a decision of whether to circumcise a male child or not, but my vote was definitely no.

  39. #189
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote Mahk View Post
    Eve, Out of curiosity, what would your reaction be to a male on the forum writing that he thought some female genitalia looked "yucky"?
    A lot of guys think some female genitalia look yucky, and they have a name for long inner labia: "beef curtains." Some guys think it's hot, fortunately.

  40. #190
    Mahk
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Oh no, I guess I’m not really a “vegan” then!

    Seriously though, I think a lot of cultures teach both girls and boys to think of female genitalia in a poor light, taboo, and something to be ashamed of. That’s sad. Media here in the US couldn’t even use the word “vagina” when Eve Ensler’s play “The Vagina Monologues” first came out a few years ago [they do now though, I think].

    One of the most important books in women’s health, “Our Bodies, Ourselves”, first published in the 1970’s but now updated and on-line, tries to reverse the taboo and encourages women to explore, accept diversity, and properly identify parts of their own genitalia using a hand mirror. (click on “Sexual Anatomy: The Self-Guided Tour” in Chapter 13 here)

    People, of both sexes, shouldn’t think of their own or anyone else’s genitalia as “yucky”.

  41. #191

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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote frank language View Post
    they have a name for long inner labia: "beef curtains."
    Oh... I felt better before I read that... really?

    Quote Mahk View Post
    People, of both sexes, shouldn’t think of their own or anyone else’s genitalia as “yucky”.
    Yes!!! Way to go, Mahk!

  42. #192
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    'Beef curtains' 'hairy axe wound' 'meat taco'...there are loads of disgustingly offensive colloquialisms for the female genitalia. Very few derogatory ones for men of course.
    Any man who ever uses such language in front of me gets a thorough grilling as to why they think it is acceptable to use such terms. That, or a punch in the mouth. I hardly ever do though, I think misogynists can spot a woman they shouldn't mess with a mile off because they're cowards. Such grossly offensive terms stem from feelings of fear and disgust about women and their genitals, and the men who use them are more like slugs (no offence to slugs) than people.
    Don't stand for it, there's no such thing as 'only language' - language serves a purpose and if it feels hurtful it was meant to be.

  43. #193
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I agree 100% about language we use (keep nasty opinions to yourself) but when I hear the 'C' word (women as often as men) I good-naturedly query how it came to be that the ugliest insult imaginable is a birth canal?

    and you are right, Frank L, wearing pants is not natural
    the only animal ingredient in my food is cat hair

  44. #194
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    My friend studied feminism as part of her politics course at uni and she said the tutor used the word c**t all through one of the lectures and loads of people got really flustered.

    I say c**t if I'm particularly angry, occasionally people get offended, but people say pr*ck or d*ckhead all the time - I hate it when people say things like 'c u next tuesday' as a euphemism.

    I had never thought about male circumcision as its not that common in UK I don't think. I was always against female circumcision for obvious reasons but I had never thought about male. I think it is mutilation, I can imagine some circumcised men must feel quite angry about it.

  45. #195
    Ex-admin Korn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    I just found out that by a mistake, members belonging to the 'Not A Vegan Yet'-category could in some cases vote in polls (in this subforum), which explains why as many as 6 "vegans" voted 'Yes' to circumcision of male babies/children. I double checked this by clicking on the 'Who voted'-button in the admin panel. According to this article (contains image of boy being circumcised), the Norwegian Dept. of Health has received suggestions from midwives who want to make circumcision of boys illegal, and they are still 'working on it'.

    http://cache.aftenposten.no/multimed...SI_586163s.jpg

  46. #196
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Its mean mean mean to circumcise a baby. It traumatises them.

    Um thats my totally unemotional, rational response.
    If i keep a green bough in my heart my singing bird will come.

  47. #197
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    NO! Circumcision was started in tha Jewish tradition to prevent masturbation of boys. There's alot of evidence to support it. It only improves "hygene" because it revomes a nook, but so would cutting off your ear. It's entirely possible to wash your penis all over, people. And it DOES increase sensitivity which DOES shorten stamina. http://www.circumcision.org/ Lots of info.

  48. #198
    snivelingchild's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote John View Post
    As an expert on the female species
    no offense

  49. #199
    Goddess foxytina_69's Avatar
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    yes to circumcision.
    "you dont have to be tall to see the moon" - african proverb

  50. #200
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    Default Re: Circumcision or no circumcision?

    Quote foxytina_69 View Post
    yes to circumcision.
    Why?

    Is that a yes to circumcising babies and children? How is it different to female circumcision? Or is that OK, too?
    "Danger" could be my middle name … but it's "John"

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