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Thread: where do you draw the line

  1. #201
    Mahk
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    ^That's much better than mine.

  2. #202

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I'm glad you like it. But I can't really take credit for it


  3. #203

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I just had a very awkward situation at work. I should not feel bad though as this person was the cause of it. I was sitting here at my security post and one of the factory workers walked by and asked if I would like some pizza that they ordered from take out that him and his co-workers ordered. I smiled and said no thank u i have my lunch here, but thank u for the offer. He kept insisting i take some. I kept saying no thank u in a polite voice. He finally was on his way, but he seemed shocked for some reason that i did not want free pizza. I thought this was the end of it.....

    20 mintues later he comes to my desk with a huge plate of food. About 4-5 slices of pizza, some dairy looking desert, and some oranges. I politely tell him no thank u i have my own lunch. He leaves all of this at my desk and walks away.....Luckily (i thought) the night janitorial crew showed up and i offered them some food and they happily accepted. (i know the janitor loves pizza, and his wife is in the cleaning crew and they seem like they are trying so hard to make ends meet) and of course if he told me no 1 time i would not push it on him.....

    then the guy that gave me the pizza in the first places comes to my desk again (i have no clue for what reason) and he see that i gave the pizza to the janitors and looks confused. I did eat the orange however which he saw....

    I dont understand people like this. Do they think they are trying to be nice? ive heard stories about old fashioned families and grandmothers and stuff that guilt their kids/guests into eating like this and they grow up overweight. In a way i feel bad for the people for giving in and eating food when they dont want to, but people also need to stand up and say no. With my situation i did not accept the food, he put it on my desk and left...and i gave it away to someone who actually wanted it right away. If the janitor would have declined i would have tossed it unfortunately. I just dont understand people that keep pushing when someone says NO!

  4. #204
    Manzana Manzana's Avatar
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I think they were just trying to be nice... in tehir own way... it might have helped if you explained why you would not eat the pizza. Some people don't see any problems with eating dairy, in fact they think it is good for you, the animals and the planet (What would happen to those poor cows if noone milked them?!)

  5. #205

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    My post didnt really have anything to do with being vegan i guess. I did not even mention that because i dont want to get into a debate at work as im a contractor at a clients site and that would be really bad. I was just shocked at how many times i could tell someone NO and have them literally force the food upon me. I shouldnt even need to explain why i dont want the food. I guess maybe i will next time, but i would really like to avoid having to explain myself at work.

  6. #206

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    @brad3104

    Sounds sort of like my family and my mom in particular. She's very insistent that her guests should eat lots of food and fill guilt you into it talking about all the food that will go to waste if someone doesn't eat (though she certainly does her part to eat as much as possible). Of course, don't dare point out that she should stop buying so much -- especially since when complains about the food bills! I think she knows that I'm not going to eat anything non-vegan, though, and is careful not to directly challenge me on this, but there's still the jabs and guilt-tripping and passive-aggressive bullshit to put up with.

    -----------------------------

    As far as the specific topic of this thread...

    My husband and I went vegan diet-wise last November as an experiment in eating healthier (particularly for him), but quickly realized that this was something that we did want to do long term and that we wanted to expand it to the rest of our lives in order to further reduce suffering. And if we had any doubts, Earthlings sealed it for us.

    We got rid of most of the obvious non-vegan food almost immediately, giving it to friends. A lot of the things we held out on soon found their way to friends, too. Fortunately, we didn't have a lot of stuff with long, hard to decipher ingredients lists, but we're trying to be good to check ingredients lists. If something could come from a vegan source, we try to give it the benefit of the doubt. Otherwise, if non-vegan ingredients are listed we avoid buying it even if it is just a little whey or honey.

    We have two pet hens so we have eggs in our household but we give them to other people to eat instead of store-bought eggs. They make great barter materials, especially since we know some people with citrus trees We also have some kitties. They're not vegan and I haven't seen a lot of good evidence that they'd be very healthy going vegan, plus we've already paid some hefty vet bills trying to switch their food just to different brands, let alone diets, so we're leaving well enough alone for now.

    We kept some honey originally, and even made an exception for some new honey since that was less of an issue for us, though we didn't end up eating any of it (at home at least) since going vegan and finally gave it away. I did have a salad with some dressing with honey in it, but I think that was the only honey we've had and we've been trying to avoid it since even though it's not something I normally grill waiters about. It's hard enough to find a waiter that knows, for example, that cheese is "dairy" and that sauces sometimes have eggs in them even if they don't see an egg sitting sunny-side-up on the plate. So, it's a battle not worth picking sometimes. We just try to avoid buying anything with it listed in the ingredients and if something was served to us with honey with the right intentions I'd eat it but maybe mention something politely if I could.

    As far as the sugar & wine stuff... I care, I do, but not enough at this point do avoid it completely. With new stuff, I'll try to buy vegan when there's a decent choice and maybe I'll do more later. But right now I have to draw a line somewhere and that's it.

    With clothes, I have so far avoided buying more animal products. For a moment it looked like we'd have to get some leather gloves for my husband because he had to do some work in the cold, needed something that would allow him to work very precisely, and he didn't have time to order something. Fortunately, we found some convertible mittens that became fingerless gloves.

    We both have some animal product clothing. I think my fave scarf is silk and I have some cashmere gloves and a sweater. My only heavy winter jacket has some fur trim on the hood, but it's too expensive for me to justify replacing right now, especially as rarely as I need to wear it here in Florida. Then there are some leather bags and shoes. I love bags and shoes, so I have quite a collection, though I've been whittling it down for other reasons. I want to eventually replace them all with vegan alternatives, but 1. my most comfortable shoes are the leather ones (cheap non-leather shoes tend to do a number on my feet) and 2. I really like to have a lot of great shoe/bag choices and don't have the money in the budget to replace them all.

    Finally, we still have some OTC meds and supplements that are non-vegan. At this point, I figure we'll just use them up and replace them, as necessary, with vegan ones when the time comes. Replacing them all now would just be too costly for us and doesn't make much sense for the sacrifice. But I know of a local herbal shop that has vegan capsules we can use to make our own pills. We even got a pill maker from there already.

    So, there it is! Sorry for such a long post but it got me thinking a lot about things and where I want to go from here. Bottom line, though, I think there's always room for improvement and the important thing is that people try.

  7. #207

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    In my case I stopped wearing/eating anything non-vegan the same dame I became vegan (at least what I thought vas non-vegan). Some people say it's difficult to change so many things, and needs to do small steps until becoming vegan. In my case it wasn't hard and it worked pretty well. Of course there were many things I didn't know but I found this forum which helped me a lot and made it even easier.
    All my fur stuff I gave it to the poor people so I don't consider wasting it. Then I bought the vegan replacements, at least the more necessary ones.

    But something happened to me a few months ago. I'm living in China and my level is still not very good so when I went to buy a new coat (I had to because the weather changed drastically) I checked the label many times reading "polyester" on it. I was surprised because it looked like wool in some parts. When I was wearing it I wasn't feeling comfortable because it looked like wool. I checked again the label and at the very end I saw a character saying "wool". I spend 50€ in that coat but I really can't wear it. Even if people here don't know me and just a few know I'm vegan (they probably don't even realize what is it) I really can't wear it. I feel bad. So the coat is in my luggage without using it. I'm not going to throw it but I'll have to figure out what to do with it.

    So in my case I just feel too bad to eat/wear something from animals. That doesn't mean I make mistakes, but when I realize I automatically stop eating/wearing them.

    I'll have to be more careful next time

  8. #208
    patientia
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I have some D3 supplements. D2 cannot be bought here.

    The year I became vegan, my aunt sent me some milk chocolates for birthday, I ate one piece because I was sorry that she payed for it, but gave the rest to my SO and never ate milk chocolate again. I got a lot of milk chocolates from her in the last 6 years, but all have gone to my SO. Finally, I told her which 2 chocolates are vegan, and now she buys me tons of these chocolates.

  9. #209
    Metal Head emzy1985's Avatar
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I am in the lucky position that I can actually genuinely claim lactose intolerance. Milk now makes me violently ill, as I found out recently after eating something at work and being told after that there was milk in it. That'll teach me! Although at least puking alot helped them realise not to do it again.

    On another level, euw honey! I can't eat it and won't eat it...it's not vegan!
    The taste of anything in my mouth for 5 seconds does not equate to the beauty and complexity of life.

  10. #210
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Interesting the different things where people draw the line ..
    Like if I'm going skipping I'll have no problems bringing back meat for others even though I don't eat it myself. Mostly I'll just trust if someone says it's vegan that it is, unless it's easy to check/obviously isn't, has meant there's been a couple 'accidents' where it wasn't but quite rarely tbh. But if I can I just don't want anything that's not vegan in my body, so I won't eat stuff like honey/D3 etc .. And when I was first vegan I would wear old shoes which happened to have small bits of leather etc on them, but got nice vegan shoes now :P
    Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe-Albert Einstein

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote leedsveg View Post
    Imagine the difficulties of trying trying to live both as a vegan and as an ultra orthodox Jew at the same time. You'd be continually deciding that something was/wasn't vegan, and then saying two seconds later 'On the other hand.......'
    I can't imagine it being any harder than being any other sort of vegan. I've actually heard that it's easier to go vegan in Israel than in the U.S. In fact, we used to have an Israeli place here that was VERY vegan-friendly. There were all sorts of vegan salads, dips/spreads, pita, falafel, and even vegan ice cream since they didn't use any dairy at all in the restaurant (easier to keep kosher that way).

  12. #212

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I try to be vegan as best I can....clothes, food, personal hygiene products etc.I make most of my food, but on occasion I go out to eat. I try my best to guess what food I eat will be vegan, but if bread has honey or the so called vegan cheese has casein, I am not going to freak out. All my friends, co-workers and family know I am vegan. If I was at their house for dinner and they served me obviously non vegan food, I'd decline...they know better.

    The bottom line is I am doing my best to have as little impact on animals as I can. But I am also not going to freak out if I accidentally get some animal products in me.

  13. #213
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I'm a new vegan and as an incredibly poor vegan, it's just not financially feasable to replace all my wool and silk clothing as a lot of it cost a lot at the time. (Damn you expensive gothy finery) Most of my clothes are cotton, lace and synthetic velvet. Fortunately I gave up leather when I went vegetarian, so that's one thing I don't need to worry about. Thank goodness.
    I don't feel bad about not throwing those things away, if people question it, I'll answer honestly. The damage was done when I paid for them, now I will use them until they need replacing.
    However, I will refuse food and gifts that aren't vegan friendly from now on, hands down. I've made a commitment and no one will make me go back. My family and friends all understand though, so I doubt they'd be that callous.
    So, that is my line.

    I've been getting all my friends to eat all the Quorn left in the freezer, LOL! Luckily, no one cooks for me and I cook for every one else! XD! and they all say that I cook food so good that they'd happily eat vegan most days if I made it.

  14. #214
    leedsveg
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Hi LysergicButterfly

    What you say seems very sensible/reasonable to me but you're the one who needs to feel comfortable with your actions and I'm glad that you do.
    I have a pair of leather shoes that I bought in 1983, 12 years before I went vegan and I still wear them for holidays. The 'vegan police' want us to get rid of such items, after all 'what will the omnis think of us?' Cobblers to the omnis, sez I!

    leedsveg

  15. #215
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote leedsveg View Post
    Hi LysergicButterfly

    What you say seems very sensible/reasonable to me but you're the one who needs to feel comfortable with your actions and I'm glad that you do.
    I have a pair of leather shoes that I bought in 1983, 12 years before I went vegan and I still wear them for holidays. The 'vegan police' want us to get rid of such items, after all 'what will the omnis think of us?' Cobblers to the omnis, sez I!

    leedsveg
    Wow! 1983! They don't make shoes like that these days! lol XD! I just see no point in throwing or giving items away when I need to keep warm and am living on very little money, it's wasteful and foolish on my part.

    Well...the difference between people like you and I, who have kept pregan items and an Omni, is the fact that we're actually trying to improve the lives of animals and the environment. All a person can do is try their best, how can they belittle us over such petty things when they're not even bothered in the slightest? so yes! Cobblers to the omnis!

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I donated and gave to friends my silk blouses, wool sweaters, and leather shoes. I still have a leather checkbook cover that I haven't replaced (with a photo of a wolf on it, from Defender's of Wildlife, hello!) and I just realized last night that I still have one skirt with 17% wool in it. My puppy decided to help me out with the shoes and chewed up two pairs (I'm sure she thought they were rawhide!) I too feel sickened when I see someone wearing leather or fur, regardless of whether it's real or not. I don't eat any animal products and hate it when I slip up and realize something I ate contains animals ingredients. I have become so careful about researching the products and foods that I buy. I don't feed my dog a vegan diet although I do sometimes make her vegan doggie snacks. My husband is an omni and I don't cook or buy animal products for him.

  17. #217

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I only have one pair of leather shoes left and they are nearing the bin days....I decided to use my (very small amount of) animal clothing until I could replace it with veggie stuff...to be honest I feel kinda sick wearing the skin of another animal but at least it reminds me why I decided to go vegan..

  18. #218
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    After becoming vegan, I picked up a pair of vegan Sauconys to wear as everyday shoes but did not have the money to invest in vegan running shoes. They are the only non-vegan item I am using up until they totally split apart--though, I feel a little ill and and saddened every time I jog in them. Even an old pair of Doc Marten workboots (which I wore for 3 labor-intensive summer jobs and still have life in them) I stopped wearing. I got a corduroy wallet from my fiancee as a gift, and a non-leather-band watch to replace my old one--and after seeing how easy and obvious it was to not use animal products, I had a wave of guilt pass over me. "Why have I not being doing this the whole time?" I inquired of myself. Those semi-suede running shoes remind me every time I wear them that in looking to promote veganism I must not forget compassion and understanding when dealing with someone who has not come to the realization yet.

    I draw the line somewhere between utility and emotions--I do not want to waste items, but there are some that simply make me too ill to look at anymore.

  19. #219
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote Shepherd Mom View Post
    My husband is an omni and I don't cook or buy animal products for him.
    Another reason I wont cook meat is the fact that as I have never cooked it, I feel like there is a high chance I would make someone ill. I'm not having that on my conscience.

  20. #220

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    How could one have a friend that gives him or her gifts, yet not know she or he is a vegan?
    All about the animals, Lucia

  21. #221
    patientia
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Well, not friends, but relatives. It took me years to explain to my aunt that I don't eat milk chocolates. In the end I just gave her names of two chocolates I do eat, and every time she comes, she brings me 5 bars of each

  22. #222
    RubyDuby
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I run into that problem with customers at work. They usually know I'm vegan, but don't understand what that means. I'm the only employee here and my boss is away right now. One of our customers brings in treats every week. I gave away a whole box of dunkin donuts munchkins yesterday. A guy came in wanting to use the phone, pretending his car had broken down, but I'm pretty sure he was homeless based on the phone conversation. He was overjoyed to take the box of donuts. She brought bagels once, that I could actually eat. I wish she'd always do that... It's hard to say, "thanks but I'm not going to eat those" when she brings donuts. I just say, "awww[my boss] will be happy!"
    Each snowflake in an avalanche pleads not guilty.

  23. #223
    rxseeeyse
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I won't eat animal products even it's someone's gift for me.
    I agree with VeganLu that all my friends knew I'm vegan so they won't ever buy me something non-vegan as presents.
    But I sometimes get made just looking at others eating animal products, therefore I wish I can separate my meals from theirs. I don't mind cooking for them as long as they don't mind eating non-animal foods.
    Therefore my line in dream would be everyone who eats me would eat vegan with me, or just simply not eating together.

  24. #224

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    -
    Last edited by MCMLXXXVI; Jul 18th, 2013 at 03:49 AM.

  25. #225

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I keep it simple. I just decline the offer of an invitation to dinner at the home of meat eaters. I would feel funny if the host or hostess made a special dinner for me and my husband. However, everyone who visits us at our home always brings us vegan treats like muffins and cookies, even though they are not vegan. I think that is so "sweet" of them, no pun intended.
    All about the animals, Lucia

  26. #226

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Hello, this is my first post here.

    I am in grade 12, and today I got in an argument with a vegetarian in one of my classes. We were discussing grad (or prom as you may know it) and aftergrad (a 'dry' event after prom we go to at the school), where there is a lot of activities, etc. I then said how I am going to bring my own food with me to the dinner dance and to the after grad because the only thing there that is going to be vegan is grilled vegetables, however they are grilled on the same grill along with the meat. To me, this is a big no-no. Flesh gets seared on a BBQ when it is cooked, hence why people leave a bbq on after cooking is finished to 'burn it off'. "Vegetarian" means "does not consume animal flesh", and I will stick to whatever means practical to ensure that I stay true to that. And plus, I just do not want that stuff inside of me. It grosses me out, and I would feel so impure... And furthermore, veganism isn't just about boycotting industries that exploit animals and the environment, it is about refusing to fuel your body at the stake of anothers life. Period.
    Anyways, this chick is lacto-ovo veg ,so you would think she could empathize on some level,and she continues to hastily say something along the lines of "That is ridiculous. It's not like you were born a vegetarian, you have eaten meat before, and if you eat again it's not going to kill you, it is a miniscule amount... etc, etc", and essentially accuse me of being neurotic. I told her that each vegetarian has a line that they draw for themselves of what they are and are not willing to, and I respect hers, so I would appreciate it if she would respect mine.

    So, how do all of you feel about eating vegan food that was cooked in/on the same cookware that meat and other animal products were freshly cooked on?

  27. #227
    Manzana Manzana's Avatar
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I tend to not attend BBQs and that kind of events whenever possible because I find it a bit yukkie to see all that burned flesh around me while I am trying to eat

    I see the point in going to some events to make a point that being a vegan is not hard and that the stuff I put on a BBQ is delicious and need not be a charred chunk of someone else's flesh! In those occassions I and my OH take our own portable BBQ and do our own thing near the rest of the people...

    Personally I dont care about eating veggies that have been cooked in the same pans as meat (as long as the pan has been washed)... it is not like I am allergic to animal products! I would not eat veg that has been cooked in the same grill as meat (unless perhaps if my veg have their own section where no meat will be cooked in that occassion and the grill looks clean before they start cooking)... I think it is not about purity, but more like basic hygiene... it is a dead animal and i do not want to cook my food where a dead body has been unless the surface has been cleaned!

  28. #228
    patientia
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    My vegetables are always grilled first on a clean grill, and then others grill their meat.

    In restaurants I ask if they grill vegetables after meat without washing the grill, and if they do, I ask them to prepare them in a skillet for me. I also ask if potatoes are fried in the same oil as animal products.

    I understand that some vegans don't mind, because, when people stop eating meat, there will be no contamination in vegan products. For instance, I don't mind possible traces of milk in chocolates. I feel stronger disgust for meat, especially when meat traces will almost certainly be there.

  29. #229
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I don't see a moral objection to eating stuff that has been cooked using the same apparatus as meat, as it doesn't contribute to animal suffering. I'm not bothered about purity either personally though I know some are.

    But it certainly is unappetising (particularly at a BBQ where you can see it happening ) , and of course you have a perfect right to avoid it, Kayleigh. I would be taking my own food too in the circs.

  30. #230

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I don't think you're neurotic at all; my husband is an omni and we use separate skillets, one for meat and one for vegan food. You're correct in that each person has to draw their own line. It's odd how certain people you'd expect to be completely empathetic, aren't. Anyway, good for you!

  31. #231

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I do dislike it if my vegan food touches anything non-vegan during the process of production, but I look over things sometimes that cannot stick to my food - e.g. bread or something - while I'm quite picky about meat and stuff. So you're not the only one. I just think it's disgusting, sorry, not even about morals.

    But where do I draw the line? Since I live in a non-vegan household and I am the only vegan, it can be difficult. E.g. I don't do the washing so I can't expect my family to use vegan washing powder, but everything that is private, I try to seperate; food and cosmeticsare all vegan. I don't use soap in public places unless I carry a piece with me.
    I do still use the leather furniture around the house - obviously, that is shared and cannot be changed easily... And my clothing is, though leather, wool, silk and fur free, probably not wholly vegan. Many of my shoes are fake leather, but not from vegan shops, so I'm afraid there won't be a guarantee whether those are vegan. However, I bought them before my vegan days and I just think it's a waste to throw them away since they're perfectly fine.

  32. #232

    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote MCMLXXXVI View Post
    I actually feel really bad when I feel the urge to ask a dinner host if something's vegan. I've had to double check if tea has soy milk in it and when it turns out it was soy milk I feel like a picky nag. I'm learning how to just trust people and if I happen to eat something that's not 100% vegan then at least I won't know about it! (Of course if something is blatantly non-vegan I won't touch it).
    I still ask, then when they tell me that it is vegan I just say thank you and explain that sometimes people forget, and that I really appreciate that they were to thoughtful and remembered! Then no one feels rude or snubbed.

  33. #233
    trudatman
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I am quite surprised by the volume of posts in this thread that state "I will use these animals until the product runs out." shoes are one thing (you often need them, right?), but makeup? totally unnecessary and deceitful and ugly and gross (your poor pores!). I'll never understand folks who get all clownfaced, but do try to impart on me a bit of the basis for needing makeup and then continuing to use said paints, knowing fully well that they are animal-based. I would think coating yourself in the slimes of dead folks would be the easiest part of old habits to give up, but I'm a logical male. pot stirred? fire away.

  34. #234
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I love make up. I don't care if it makes me a clown And for the record I did use up my non vegan make up. And I don't feel bad about it, id feel worse if I wasted it. You can judge me and people like me. that’s fine. but i'll still wear it if I feel so inclined to do so.

    4 things that make me feel awesome.

    1. Bright red lipstick.

    2. Super high heals.
    3. Being Vegan.

    4. Remaining true to myself.

    "i'm rejecting my reflection, cause i hate the way it judges me."

  35. #235
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote trudatman View Post
    shoes are one thing (you often need them, right?), but makeup? totally unnecessary and deceitful and ugly and gross (your poor pores!).
    I don't see the logic in this - people don't need to wear leather shoes or use animal-based makeup but if they have some of either there seems to me to be an equal case for using it/them up. Why exactly would the fact that shoes are necessary but makeup is not alter the case?

    Also calling makeup "deceitful" begs a whole lot of questions - among them one about the implication that people wear it for observers, whereas I think they often wear it to please themselves. (I don't generally wear any myself, for the record.)
    Last edited by harpy; May 19th, 2010 at 09:00 PM. Reason: said opposite of what meant :-/

  36. #236
    leedsveg
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Not sure I want to comment re make-up. All I can do is quote that old saying:

    Beauty is only skin deep, but ugly goes to the bone.


    lv

  37. #237
    BlackCats
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote missbettie View Post

    4 things that make me feel awesome.

    1. Bright red lipstick.

    2. Super high heals.
    3. Being Vegan.

    4. Remaining true to myself.

    I'm sure you look beautiful too MissB.

  38. #238
    missbettie's Avatar
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    aw thanks!
    "i'm rejecting my reflection, cause i hate the way it judges me."

  39. #239
    baffled harpy's Avatar
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    And leedsveg as well - I feel sure he's beautiful, at least when he's wearing his slap

  40. #240
    leedsveg
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote harpy View Post
    And leedsveg as well - I feel sure he's beautiful, at least when he's wearing his slap
    WYSIWYG!

    My wife Jean gave a talk last week to a social group and afterwards the group organiser wrote to Jean thanking her for giving the talk, and also for bringing her "dishy husband"!!??

    (I personally wouldn't describe myself as "dishy", but who am I to argue with my fans?!)

    lv

  41. #241
    rxseeeyse
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    wow, so much happened

    FOR Kayleigh~~ I think grill with animals are ABSOLUTELY disgusting. I live in vancouver too but vancouver Canada. I live near surrey, and the Pita place in Surrey Central is soooo disgusting! they put up a sign saying "we grill our meat and vegetables on different grills" and there, the girl working just put the meat in the middle of two grills, wow, nice going. About prom, when I went last year, they did have salad there, u can jsut eat it without dressing and bring ur snaks, I think nothing is wrong with that~~~

    About the shoes...I really feel like I do not have the economics standard to buy something vegan, therefore I continue to wear my old clothes, its not like I continue to buy antyhing animal product. Once they break then I will buy new ones that are vegan, therefore I dont see how is this a non-vegan thing to do. About make-ups I hold the same opinions. Maybe people just prefer different things in life, I like make-ups and I think there's nothing wrong with that.

  42. #242
    Blake
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I believe once it was particularly cold and rainy outside, and I borrowed a leather coat for an hour or so. I wouldn't generally wear leather though, even second hand, as I find it disgusting.

    I won't eat animal products to 'be nice'; I don't consider it that nice to deceive a friend. Your friend is trying to help you have a nice time, and by hiding how unpleasant you're finding it, you're being counter-productive. Better to explain things, and say how you appreciate the effort but to please not worry about preparing food, or to request fruit in the future (make it clear that if anything, you prefer fresh fruit, because it's very hard to accidentally mess that up, so no hurt feelings in the future).

  43. #243
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I eat no animal products, ever, no matter where I am and who I'm with. My boyfriend's parents are chicken farmers so believe me when I say they don't like me much! (I am very polite but they still dislike me because I love animals). They don't like having me over because they think its a "hassle" to prepare meals for me (fair enough I'd cook for myself..). So does my extended and even close family. They are constantly on my back about how hard it is for them to cook for me (noone is asking you to!) but I frankly don't care what they think. Why should I give up my ethics for what's convenient for them?

    What I DO care about is the billions of animals dying the world over because of human arrogance.

    Things I don't and will never eat are: Meat products, milk products, egg products and white poison (refined sugar). For the record even if someone proves that sugar is 110% vegan, which I don't believe it is but thats another thread, I still wouldn't put that stuff in my body!

    I'm basically raw but will eat some whole grains and soy products sparingly and on occasion.

    I also do not use any products that have either ingredients that come from animals or have been tested on animals.

    People always complain that I'm a fanatic but someone needs to be for the sake of these animals.

  44. #244

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    To Tiffany:

    You sound like a strong minded person and I applaud you for your compassion for all animals. I just want to give you some hints. One, never eat the main course with family and friends that are not vegan. Try just coming forf desert, but bring your own. I am sorry that your friends and family call you fanatic. Try not eating with them if you can. You should not be talked to that way. You are honoring them by being with them and they should not taunt you like that. Another hint is to spend more time with vegans, eat with THEM, your allies, and you will become even stronger in your convictions and not feel so bad when people call you a fanatic. I personally think that they have a lot of nerve to call you anything. You know that they are all murderers, sadists and hypocrites when you think about it, and they call you names? Good luck and keep on keeping on. By the way, some meat eating people are intimidated by you and by attacking your beliefs they are feeling better about their evil ways.
    All about the animals, Lucia

  45. #245
    Kimberlily1983
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote Roxy View Post
    I have a wool sweater too. I didn't wear it this past winter and I'm thinking that it will be donated to a charity store before too long.
    When I became vegan I tossed all my wool sweaters in a pile and decided I would get around to giving them away. A couple of months later, something (I can't remember what) tipped me off to check the labels; I had encountered something that I thought was wool and had found it to be acrylic or cotton. So I checked my sweaters, and sure enough, about half of them or so didn't have any wool, etc. in the them and were completely vegan! It was an exciting day, LOL. I loved my sweaters, and all this time had not been wearing them, when many were still suitable for me. They're also the ones that are the comfiest (no scratching!).

    So yes, I imagine not everyone is as ignorant as I was about what's in their clothes, but just a heads up to the handful of you that might make the same mistake I did.

  46. #246
    Kimberlily1983
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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I'm with most people on this topic: I just can't consume animal products anymore. Even in a situation where it wasn't presenting a moral dilemma (where, for instance, the food would be thrown out and couldn't be given away to someone else), I just can't. I think I would be sick if I tried. It's just not food to me anymore, and it's the remains - or products - of a sentient being! Honestly, I think my reaction would be exactly the same as if I was being offered human meat.

    I don't think less of people who could eat animal products under such circumstances, though. The crucial point to me, of being vegan, is that we don't in any way contribute to animal exploitation. As long as it didn't tempt you to give up your veganism, or mean that the people offering you their food were going to go shop for more (because you're eating what could be their leftovers, for instance), I don't see it as wrong. Some vegans never lose their taste for meat, dairy, etc. and this is the sort of thing they might be able to do: I have lost the taste for animal products, and I couldn't do it. It's conceivable that these sorts of vegans might even help our cause, because it shows people that it's not just a "purity" thing, that we're not rigidly adhering to something even in situations where it doesn't actually do any moral good. For myself, the reason I wouldn't eat the meat - or whatever it is - in that situation is not so much moral; rather it's a matter of taste, of feeling squeamish about something and holding the attitude that what's being presented to me is not food.

    Interesting question and discussion!

  47. #247

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote Kimberlily1983 View Post
    I'm with most people on this topic: I just can't consume animal products anymore. Even in a situation where it wasn't presenting a moral dilemma (where, for instance, the food would be thrown out and couldn't be given away to someone else), I just can't. I think I would be sick if I tried. It's just not food to me anymore, and it's the remains - or products - of a sentient being!
    I agree with you. I havenīt bought animal products for almost a year now but until some weeks ago I did eat non-vegan things if they were offered to me and I wanted to be polite, or when my bf and I were eating out and I felt strange about asking for vegan options. But somehow I realised that I didnt want these compromises any more because, no, I simply donīt want to eat something which isnīt meant to be food, thereīs nothing wrong with that and I donīt have to feel bad about it.

    As for the clothes question, I originally wanted to continue wearing my shoes and woollen things but somehow ended up buying vegan alternatives and wearing them all the time although my leather shoes were still there. However I couldnīt just throw them out, so Iīd give them to a charity or non-vegan friends.

  48. #248

    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    Quote Lukka View Post
    I agree with you. I havenīt bought animal products for almost a year now but until some weeks ago I did eat non-vegan things if they were offered to me and I wanted to be polite, or when my bf and I were eating out and I felt strange about asking for vegan options. But somehow I realised that I didnt want these compromises any more because, no, I simply donīt want to eat something which isnīt meant to be food, thereīs nothing wrong with that and I donīt have to feel bad about it.

    As for the clothes question, I originally wanted to continue wearing my shoes and woollen things but somehow ended up buying vegan alternatives and wearing them all the time although my leather shoes were still there. However I couldnīt just throw them out, so Iīd give them to a charity or non-vegan friends.
    That's great, Lukka.
    It is good to see that the realisation that animal products are not for our use has been such a rapid one for you. It can be difficult for some people to embrace the liberation that comes from rejecting their use for all sorts of reasons which feel valid enough to them at the time.
    ..but what would they do with all the cows?..

  49. #249

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    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    horselesspaul, I have to admit that the opportunity of vegan shoe-shopping helped to speed up the process .

  50. #250

    Default Re: where do you draw the line

    I live in the vegan bubble called Brighton in the UK where we have a shop called Vegetarian Shoes so it's always been easy (if not cheap) for me but I also find that cheap footwear generally tends to be animal free and the labelling can show this. All my five kinds of football boots (futsal, indoor 5 a side, outdoor astro, outdoor soft ground, outdoor hard ground) are vegan, obviously, which is nice and were not expensive. Animal based glues are very much a thing of the past in the footwear industry I gather now too.
    ..but what would they do with all the cows?..

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