Bone density and calcium post-menopause

[Insomniak]

I recently had a DEXA bone density scan and came out with scores just barely clear of Osteoporosis leaving me in the Osteopenia bracket.

I'm 57, I've been vegan for just over 2 years and before that 10 years of being totally vegetarian. I've a very reasonably good and balanced diet with regular exercise (mostly walking) though that has lessened in the last 18 months due to toe joint pain.

I'm now on Calcichew D3 Forte twice daily.
Each tablet contains 1250mg calcium carbonate equivalent to 500mg calcium and 400iu colecalciferol equivalent to 10micrograms Vit D3.
I'm making a serious effort to include more high-calcium veg every day, too.
I'm also working on increasing walk-time to 45 mins per day.

Is this enough to make a difference?
I'd appreciate your opinions and any input you have, please!

Reading a lot of the posts here about calcium and supplements, many of you seem to think as I did, that I was getting adequate calcium without the need to supplement it, of course now I'm thinking quite differently.
Perhaps I was just not absorbing it well enough?

So... if any of you have had a bone density scan with unexpected results, I'd like to hear your experience and what remedial action you've taken and how much success you've had.

Thanks!

[Sarabi]

I dunno. It's probably a good idea to get a medical check-up periodically... though I don't because it's too expensive. Wait till I finish college and get a job...

[Hemlock]

http://www.osteopenia3.com/Cause-of-Osteopenia.html

I thought this was quite interesting! It can be genetic or due to smoking/drinking too much over the years (that's me ff'd then), a sedentary lifestyle and not eating enough fruit and veg. It doesn't say anything about eating truckloads of dairy every day!

Personally I believe the western life is much too sedentary, if we ran everywhere or had to work the land for a living we'd probably not develop this. The western diet is also largely responsible, junk food and too much of it.

Of course it could also be part of the natural ageing process, we all age differently.

[Insomniak]

I dunno. It's probably a good idea to get a medical check-up periodically... though I don't because it's too expensive. Wait till I finish college and get a job...

Thing is, I rarely had the need to visit the doctor at all! About every 10 years I'd see my Homoeopath and that was it.
He ordered the DEXA scan, telling me that in the first 7 years after the onset of menopause you lose something like 20% of bone density.
So I guess if I'd had the scan 6 or 7 years ago it would have shown up some initial bone loss and I could have tackled it then and probably prevented it getting to this stage.

Sarabi, I think you don't need worry for a good few years yet!

[Insomniak]

http://www.osteopenia3.com/Cause-of-Osteopenia.html

I thought this was quite interesting! It can be genetic or due to smoking/drinking too much over the years (that's me ff'd then), a sedentary lifestyle and not eating enough fruit and veg. It doesn't say anything about eating truckloads of dairy every day!

Personally I believe the western life is much too sedentary, if we ran everywhere or had to work the land for a living we'd probably not develop this. The western diet is also largely responsible, junk food and too much of it.

Of course it could also be part of the natural ageing process, we all age differently.

Thanks, Hemlock!
I have that site bookmarked, it's excellent. A great source of info.
Yep, the alcohol connection is disappointing, definitely! That'll be one avenue of pleasure restricted for me from now on!
I never smoked, but I did eat a decent daily ration of chocolate in my pre-vegan days.

Anyway, I'm dealing with this, finding info and making changes and maybe it's good to have a challenge like this. Hah!

[Hemlock]

I think osteoporosis is something we all need to think about while still young enough to do something about it. Prevention is always better than cure.
It's no fun breaking a leg just by sneezing (severe cases) and can happen to anyone.

[harpy]

Thanks for sharing your experience, Insomniak. It sounds as if you are doing the right things, weight-bearing exercise etc, although I'm in no position to say whether it's enough - presumably your doc thinks so?

Incidentally I don't think being a vegan is necessarily associated with higher incidences of osteoporosis - there are some other threads about this e.g. http://www.veganforum.com/forums/sho...t=bone+density

It does seem to be possible to slow or arrest, if not reverse, the problem - I have a non-vegan friend who has had low bone density readings in the past but last time they told her it was normal for her age - she has been taking medicine for it though.

Good luck -

[BlackCats]

Sorry to hear that Insomniak. It sounds like you are doing all the right things now though so hopefully it will improve.

Both my grandmothers and my mother in law (all non-vegetarian) all have osteoporosis so it worries me a bit about calcium so last year I started taking a calcium and vitamin D supplement a few times a week. I also spoke to a vegan guy who told me about a study that showed there was a greater incidence of fractures amongst vegans, I think it is 30% higher than for meat-eaters and vegetarians. This risk goes away if more calcium is added to the diet though so I thought it would be better to start adding extra calcium at my age as I'm not sure I take enough from food sources.

[harpy]

That's interesting, thanks, BC - I hadn't read about that study before but I just found this one through Google which sounds as if it could be the one in question

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17299475

Nobody in my family has had osteoporosis as far as I know but I will think about taking extra calcium. Vitamin D also seems likely to be a factor and I do take that in winter (when I remember )

[cobweb]

I seem to crave calcium quite often and eat stacks of tofu and broccoli.
Osteoporosis also runs in my mum's side of the family so its something to think on . I'm sure i have strong bones as i've had loads of bad accidents and never broken anything except my nose. I have big massive strong legs, too! .

[Insomniak]

BlackCats, I can see why you'd worry a bit about it given that it's in the family. You're doing the right thing tackling it early anyway. Prevention is the key.
You see, it *doesn't* run in any part of my family, so I guess I just never expected it at all!

I'm sure it's been slowly building up (or down!) over the last 7 or 8 years and the fact that up until I went vegan 2 years ago I used to eat cheese by the cartload, is added proof that dairy is NOT a good calcium source for the human.

[Insomniak]

Harpy, I in no way attribute it to being vegan, if anything I'm more careful about food intake since becoming vegan and have always eaten plenty of tofu and broccoli, too!
However, I like my alcohol and coffee and maybe those two things, combined have contributed to it.
Never smoked, so I can't blame that.

Anyway, as I said, early bone scans for everyone!!

At least now I know where I stand and I can do what I can to halt the progress or even reverse it a bit.

[harpy]

BTW being very thin is meant to be associated with increased risk of osteoporosis - see for example http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1109192742.htm - I should be OK on that score In the fracture study BC mentioned they would presumably have adjusted for body weight.

[harpy]

Good point about the bone scans - I don't think it's something that's done routinely here but I might be wrong. My friend with osteo didn't seem to have one until a problem became evident, but that was a few years ago so it may have changed.

[Kate1978]

Our company is offering a bone scan, I'm in my early 30s so thought I was way too young for that. Having second thoughts now, might be worth it after all!

[cedarblue]

i have read repeatedly that it is not always the lack of calcium and so the need to replenish it which is the problem - moreover, the amount of protein consumed, which can leach the calcium out of the bones.

[Kate1978]

^ Apparently excess protein makes the body more acidic and this leaches calcium from the bones?

[herbwormwood]

Calcium is not the only issue with osteoporosis. There are a lot of dietary factors, for example vitamin D, involved, but exercise is also very important, possibly more so in some cases.

The uk vegan society has a lot of useful info on diet and bone density.

Insomniak yes you do need to be concerned if you are already osteopenic.
I suggest you get some advice about the kind of exercise you can do without making your pain worse.
In general exercise which builds muscle is good, because as muscle grows, bone density grows with it, but swimming is no good for bone density because it doesn't have any impact, neither does cycling. In fact cyclists who don't do much other exercise have bone density issues.
So you could get advice at a gym or from a physio.

[Quantum Mechanic]

I know I get plenty of calcium, as I eat lots of broccoli, tofu, and fortified rice milk and soy yogurt. However, I don't get nearly enough vitamin D and am very sedentary right now (have only left the house twice last three months, briefly, hardly walk around). I've had joint stiffness in my fingers and knees for years, which briefly went away and now is back with a vengeance (and crackling) as well as numbness and tingling and pain. Here's to hoping the colonoscopy offers clues (although the CT scan a few months ago detected the inflammation in the terminal ileum, so maybe not, but pain has been spreading so who knows)!