Do we really need to use toothbrushes/toothpaste/floss?

[mariogirl]

I know there are vegan options out there and whatnot, but is tooth brushing/flossing even necessary when a person is healthy and constantly hydrated and all that? I wonder if tooth brushing/flossing may be similar to douching and unnecessary. I've been using baking soda for a while when I learned it was cheaper, but I'm still using non-vegan dental floss I had before I went all vegan and stuff. I'm just wondering if there's a point in me even buying floss (vegan) anymore.

[harpy]

There certainly is for me, my teeth get furry and 'orrible if I don't clean them thoroughly. Eating apples etc helps but I don't think it does the job. Have you tried skipping a clean to see what happens?

[xrodolfox]

When I went 18 months without a teeth cleaning, it took 3 very long visits to clean my teeth back to normal. I get buildup and gum disease quite easily.

However, I have never had a cavity in 32 years of life and that was even when as a kid I went 1 month w/out brushing my teeth right after halloween and eating candy every day 5 times a day. That's not just genes, but also floridated water.

I think that some folks can pull off not brushing. I might be able to now, since my teeth and gums are in better shape than ever before. However, I am also quite sure, do to experience, that if I went without for a year (like before), my teeth would not stay as healthy, and what happens to my teeth is an indicator as well as a precursor for the rest of my body.

[RubyDuby]

going to the dentist tomorrow after 7 years... will report back. (can see holes in my teeth... not been eating a total "healthy" vegan diet so, my bad. )

[BlackCats]

I read that not flossing can cause the bacteria to travel around your bloodstream and can lead to heart problems (something like that anyway.) I took my cats to the vet and she said it was important to look after their teeth as neglecting their teeth can be linked to health problems later in their lives.

My teeth feel weird if I don't floss twice a day anyway but my teeth are quite crowded in my mouth so I don't know if someone with more spaced out teeth would need to.

[cobweb]

I don't floss because it makes my gums bleed. I do clean my teeth at least twice a day, every day, but i've been told to lighten up a bit because my heavy handed brushing is causing my gums to recede.

I never visit a dental hygenist anymore, they have definitely caused me problems in the past. I have very sensitive teeth which dislike being poked and prodded.

[harpy]

I feel the same way as you about hygienists CW. I've recently found an NHS dentist and when I went (I've only been once so far) hygienists weren't mentioned; I think I read somewhere the NHS doesn't cover them unless there's a clinical reason. How long have you not been to one for if you don't mind my asking?

[Marrers]

I get buildup and gum disease quite easily . . . I think that some folks can pull off not brushing.

Some people (like me) are apparently more susceptible to gum disease due to genetic factors. As BC says gum disease is linked to heart disease and other serious health issues so it's something I wouldn't recommend taking a chance on. It's like the people you hear about who can smoke every day and live til they are 100 - some people can but how do you know if you'll be one of them until it's too late!

I didn't floss before (I was put off because it used to make my gums bleed and pull out fillings every time I tried) but recent problems have forced me to start doing so and I've realised it is all about technique.

It's costing me a huge amount of time and money trying to sort out my teeth and gums now (I may have to have gum surgery and will lose teeth) and they will never be properly right. I'd urge everyone to take good care of their teeth and gums and keep them in good shape - I wish I had.


eta I should add that I was going to the dentist very regularly (I was always breaking my fillings) and also saw the hygienist quite a few times but she was stumped by the gum disease I had even though my mouth was clean - they like to imagine if you have a good brushing technique your gums will be fine but this is not true for people like me once gum disease has taken hold. I got frustrated with doing everything I was told and not getting any better so I stopped going (stuck my head in the sand) but if anyone else has these issues please seek a specialist opinion sooner rather than later.

[Mollfie]

I have weak teeth, I get cavities very easily despite eating very little sugar. My mum is the same so it's a genetic thing apprently?

[Zero]

To answer the question, no you don't "need to" but unless you want to have yellow teeth and all sorts of tooth problems then it's probably best to.

Perhaps if a person never eats any processed sugar they are less likely to have tooth problems but still, there is too much research that show that it is necessary whereas the ideas about how there is "no need" to brush your teeth are largely unsupported pseudo science nonsense in my experience.

[snaffler]

Bacteria and dirt in teeth are connected to heart disease if not kept clean so it is worth making that extra effort.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Bad-T...ck-65225.shtml

[Hemlock]

Trust me dental hygiene is essential! My grandfather brushed twice a day and flossed with sewing cotton daily in the days when dental floss wasn't even invented (he was born in 1890) and he still had all his own teeth at 85 when he died.
Don't be afraid to ask for a local anaesthetic if your teeth are agony when being cleaned by a hygienist. My hygienist always leaves my two bottom teeth to be done by the dentist under local as I can't tolerate them being cleaned otherwise. NHS dentists don't like (can't be bothered) doing it but I make them
I broke a tooth accidentally recently Marrers and it had to be extracted, the cost of implants in this country is astronomical - £2000 per tooth!!! I've booked myself in to go to Hungary in September to get the implant and some ceramic fillings - 100 times cheaper and they do very good work.

[RubyDuby]

I don't floss because it makes my gums bleed.

Mine do too, because I don't floss often... just got back from dentist. Will need 6 fillings and I have a mild case of gingivitis. That's much better than anticipated! The dentist said if I floss regularly the gingivitis will clear itself up.

[cobweb]

I feel the same way as you about hygienists CW. I've recently found an NHS dentist and when I went (I've only been once so far) hygienists weren't mentioned; I think I read somewhere the NHS doesn't cover them unless there's a clinical reason. How long have you not been to one for if you don't mind my asking?

It's been a couple of years now, Harpy, which may not be long enough to know if it's affecting my teeth. I clean them with bicarb of soda now and again which makes them feel really clean, like hygeinist clean. I had my teeth checked over the other day and they seem to be good.

[cobweb]

Mine do too, because I don't floss often... just got back from dentist. Will need 6 fillings and I have a mild case of gingivitis. That's much better than anticipated! The dentist said if I floss regularly the gingivitis will clear itself up.

could be worse i suppose
hrm, maybe i should try flossing again, i just hate having a sore bleeding mouth

[veganwitch]

Mine do too, because I don't floss often... just got back from dentist. Will need 6 fillings and I have a mild case of gingivitis. That's much better than anticipated! The dentist said if I floss regularly the gingivitis will clear itself up.

Glad it went better than expected Rubes.
I know if I miss even one day of flossing my gums bleed the next time I do floss

[missbettie]

could be worse i suppose
hrm, maybe i should try flossing again, i just hate having a sore bleeding mouth

your mouth will feel better after a few days if you do it regularily. try switching the type of floss your using, the wax floss is the smoothiest and easiet to get in btwn teeth that way you are less likely to hurt urself.

[Hemlock]

We use Desert Essence tea tree oil dental tape from the health food shop. It's vegan and the dental tape is very thick and waxed so there is no way you can hurt your gums with it. The other stuff in the shops is horrible and way too thin. They do the thinner floss as well but I can't use that.
You can read more about it here:

http://www.veganstore.co.uk/mm5/merc...egory_Code=820

[Hemlock]

I feel the same way as you about hygienists CW. I've recently found an NHS dentist and when I went (I've only been once so far) hygienists weren't mentioned; I think I read somewhere the NHS doesn't cover them unless there's a clinical reason. How long have you not been to one for if you don't mind my asking?

I had a lot of problems with NHS dentists doing very sloppy work and not referring to a hygienist when there was a clear need. My dentist once ignored two cavities for 2 years. Now I always check all my teeth with a mirror and insist on having treatment if it's needed. Like you was also never referred to a hygienist for stubborn plaque areas so now I insist on an NHS referral and go every 3 months.
My last NHS dentist struck me off for asking to be referred to a hygienist so I reported them to their governing body. You don't have to put up with shoddy treatment from NHS dentists.

[harpy]

That's annoying, Hemlock, and I agree they should refer you to a hygienist if you need one.

I wasn't actually complaining about mine though because I'm not convinced frequent hygienist visits are essential unless there's a specific need - the area seems a bit controversial in some circles http://freakonomics.blogs.nytimes.co...eaning-a-scam/

This new NHS dentist (who was recommended by various locals) seems quite thorough and gave the teeth a clean herself which is what every dentist I went to used to do until 15 or 20 years ago when they all suddenly acquired seemed to acquire hygienists. Of course I may change my mind if I wake up and find all my teeth lying on my pillow one day

I do spend ages buggering about cleaning mine with various different brushes and floss every day, I find it makes quite a difference to how they feel.

[Marrers]

maybe i should try flossing again, i just hate having a sore bleeding mouth

I don't know if you are using the correct technique but I certainly wasn't - I thought the purpose of flossing was to clean between the teeth (which led to me ramming to floss vertically down into the gum) rather than under the gumline. I also found it difficult to hold the floss properly and manoeuvre it around without having a mouthful of fingers! (At first I found it easier to use 'flossAwl' in one hand and wrap the floss normally in the other but now I've got used to flossing I can manage without it.)

My dentist explained that the floss should 'hug' the tooth and I found the illustrations on this page very useful.

[cobweb]

the trouble is my teeth have no gap atall between them which makes flossing really difficult, i try to do it gently but it's so hard to move it up the tooth and then it suddenly shoots up at the last moment, grrr.

The worst damage to my teeth is from my grinding and clenching of them over the years, the bottom front teeth are very worn, poor things.

[RubyDuby]

I think we have the same mouth, cobweb!
My teeth are also very crowded and that makes it difficult to floss. (try it without a left hand. )

My dentist is also referring me to an orthodontist once the filling are taken care of. The muscles on my lower jaw are so enormous from grinding at night that it is beginning to jut forward, so when I close my mouth the fronts of my lower teeth scrape the backs of my upper teeth. He said I might need braces, but definitely a mouth guard, which will be $300-400. My teeth are excessively worn for my age, and he said in 10 years I may not have much of my front teeth left if I don't do something to stop it now.

[burl]

I have to say that flossing is very important. Most tooth decay I have been told my dental professionals occurs in areas with tooth to tooth contact. Flossing helps remove pieces of material that get stuck between teeth. Not flossing can lead to sever tooth decay which unfortunately I learned.
There's also nothing wrong with your gums bleeding. It means you need to brush and floss more to prevent gum disease and strengthen your gums.

[harpy]

Here's a helpful instructional video for you flossing sceptics

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7940052.stm

or here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NeXg0M1KBG4

[Marrers]

The muscles on my lower jaw are so enormous from grinding at night

I read about botox injections being used to relax the muscles. Est was also telling me about Feldenkrais being helpful.

[cobweb]

I think we have the same mouth, cobweb!
My teeth are also very crowded and that makes it difficult to floss. (try it without a left hand. )

My dentist is also referring me to an orthodontist once the filling are taken care of. The muscles on my lower jaw are so enormous from grinding at night that it is beginning to jut forward, so when I close my mouth the fronts of my lower teeth scrape the backs of my upper teeth. He said I might need braces, but definitely a mouth guard, which will be $300-400. My teeth are excessively worn for my age, and he said in 10 years I may not have much of my front teeth left if I don't do something to stop it now.

i reckon we both have similar stress/anger type issues that lead us to grind our teeth so much
i had a guard made for me a few years ago but i chewed it to bits

and yes, that must be flippin impossible to floss one-handed

[Shepherd Mom]

If you floss every day for a week, your gums should stop bleeding. I read that any blood when flossing is an indication of gum disease. I floss twice a day, pretty much every day; my mouth just feels cleaner and my dentist visits are very quick due to a lack of scraping!I noticed that eating a lot of apples has made my teeth slightly whiter.

[cobweb]

i don't think i have gum disease as dentists always say my mouth and teeth look fine (apart from the grinding!) - i think i just make my gums bleed because my teeth are tightly packed making flossing very difficult.

[veganwitch]

Reading this thread makes me think I should start flossing twice a day instead of once. I hate the scraping they do at the dentist's *shudder*.

Also once I mistakenly bought the dental tape instead of dental floss. Well, I didn't think I had closely packed teeth until I tried the dental tape. I could not get it through my teeth b/c of the thickness of it. My husband tried it and he had the same problem. So we stick to regular floss and it works fine.

Ruby, have you tried those little flossers on a stick? I'm sure that's not what they are really called but they are on a little plastic stick that I would think makes one-handed flossing easier.

[harpy]

You can get small interdental brushes that might also be easier to use with one hand than floss (though my last dentist reckoned it was good to use both....)

I hope you've all looked at my flossing videos further up the thread - it's worth it

[RubyDuby]

My old dentist gave me some of those flossers on a stick... they're worthless. My teeth are too close together or something. I don't really have that hard of a time. I have my method down. (I don't do it one handed... I just don't technically have a left "hand")

could be worse i suppose

I'd waited so long to go and was in pain (which I know now is from the grinding) so expected the worst... like pulled teeth and root canals. Fillings I'll take! I only have 2 cavities, but need 4 more fillings from holes in my teeth... I thought a hole in a tooth was a cavity, but I guess not in the dental world.

i had a guard made for me a few years ago but i chewed it to bits

that's the point! so you aren't chewing your teeth to bits.

[cobweb]

that's the point! so you aren't chewing your teeth to bits

i know, but literally, it was all nasty in a short time and i couldn't afford to keep getting new ones!
i have trained myself to relax my jaw now which seems to help to a point

[Marrers]

I'm not sure what floss I'm using at the moment because my dentist gave it to me - it came in a promotional credit card type package to advertise his business but it's great, really easy to use.
I bought one of those cute Alessi creatures that holds floss and the floss included in it is awful, hard to slide in and out as it seems to stick to the teeth and it frays easily - so the type of floss you use makes a huge difference (as does zig-zagging it in and out from between the teeth, using a sawing motion).

[harpy]

I had some from T*sc* (I think it was) that frayed - useless, but I usually find it works OK. Perhaps the dentist would divulge where the superior stuff came from.

In case I forgot to ask, HAVE YOU ALL WATCHED MY FLOSSING VIDEO???? You'll be glad you did (probably).

[RubyDuby]

Monkey's teaching infants to floss... cute.

I don't have sound on my computer, but I assume it's not necessary?

[harpy]

Clever, aren't they? No, I don't think there was any sound.

[Hemlock]

Just be careful, a lot of dental floss is not vegan!

[harpy]

Good point Hemlock - don't know if mine is, have just ordered a consignment from Veganstore (along with some chocolate to undo the good work!).

I suppose human hair would be OK, if finished with or voluntarily donated.

[African_Prince]

Brushing your teeth and flossing are both absolute musts.

In many traditional cultures, there is a kind of chewing stick that people use to clean their teeth but we don't have that in the West and oral health care is important.

[RubyDuby]

last night was the first time my gums didn't bleed from flossing! It was exactly 1 wk of daily flossing.

Now I just wish I could wake up in the morning with my mouth guard still in my mouth...

[Shepherd Mom]

last night was the first time my gums didn't bleed from flossing! It was exactly 1 wk of daily flossing.

Now I just wish I could wake up in the morning with my mouth guard still in my mouth...

Yay! No more bleeding gums. I love to floss my teeth and I love going to the dentist. There's just something about all that scraping and polishing....yeah, I'm weird. Don't even get me started on Novicain. BTW, what is a good brand of vegan floss? My teeth are really packed tight in the back and just shred anything that isn't similar to the "glide" type. Any suggestion?

[RubyDuby]

I've been using Glide
Is that bad?

One of the customer's at work is married to a dentist who just sold his business. She brought us in high end electric toothbrushes, reg toothbrushes, toothpaste and floss. I passed the paste onto my boss, but didn't think twice about the floss. I just read on here about it possibly not being vegan, but figured I'd finish it up before researching an alternative.

[harpy]

The floss I got from veganstore seems OK; the brand is Desert Essence I think, and it seems to slip between tightly-packed fangs (which I also have) at least as easily as the kind I had already.

[keikilanipulama76]

I don't floss because it makes my gums bleed. I do clean my teeth at least twice a day, every day, but i've been told to lighten up a bit because my heavy handed brushing is causing my gums to recede.

I never visit a dental hygenist anymore, they have definitely caused me problems in the past. I have very sensitive teeth which dislike being poked and prodded.

Your gums bleed when you floss because you don't floss. Bleeding gums when you floss is not a good sign. If you don't brush your teeth or floss, you will get gum disease. I never use to floss and went to the dentist several years ago, and he said that I was starting to develop gum disease.

If you like having food and hard plaque stuck between your teeth and gums, causing them to recede, then have fun with with that.

Dental hygiene is important, I'm not sure how going to the dentist to have cavities filled, teeth cleaned, or to get checked for oral cancer became a bad thing.

[Barley]

I had a very mild case of sore gum a few years ago and my dentist advised an electric toothbrush which cleans the gums too. It worked and has been very good, even though the heads are quite expensive - well worth it!

[harpy]

I've found an electric one useful too Barley. I feel as if I shouldn't need it, but if I go away and use a manual one for a few days they don't feel as clean however carefully I brush. Perhaps if one had a better brushing technique than mine it wouldn't make such a difference.

[Tigerlily]

My dentist told me to stop using my electric toothbrush. It can cause receeding gumlines if you are not careful.

[RubyDuby]

mine said it wouldn't! as long as it was a good one.

[VeganGran]

My dentist told me to use an electric toothbrush, he said the high speed stimulates the gums??!!