Gara Rufa fish spa: need information regarding objections to

[philfox]

I'm not sure where to post this.

A friend of mine is working for a local beauty spa who will soon be offering this treatment (the ones were the little carp nibble dead skin off people's feet) and they wondered if I had any information regarding the ethical objections to it (they are upset at this - the fish live 2-5 years and they are concerned it will be a fad for maybe 1-2 years). I've tried googling for information regarding ethical objections, some concrete evidence of the damage my friend and I assume it will do to the fish, but I can only find glowing reviews for it.

I would like enough information about the negative aspects to at least write a fairly comprehensive letter to a local paper or the company itself.

[philfox]

I've just read on the Independent's website that Superdrug are opening a fish spa in their Kensington store with a view to open them elsewhere in at least two other stores

[harpy]

Did you see this article from yesterday's Observer mentioning some objections to the practice, philfox? http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...re?INTCMP=SRCH

[philfox]

I didn't, thank you Harpy. Mum said she saw someone mention possible objections over it on BBC news yesterday morning, she said the chap was trying to read from the Independent (hence me searching there). Thanks for the link to the Observer piece. I'm just getting so fed up of these spas and no one takes my objections seriously. There is a 'store' in one of the shopping centres in Hull, purely dedicated to these fish 'spas'. I just don't understand .

[harpy]

Maybe if people think there's a health risk they will be less keen, even if they don't care about the poor old fish

[philfox]

Yeah, just everything I've read points to it being healthy and no danger of infections being transferred etc. It's as much the lack of stimulus and enrichment in their tanks as much as the exploitation of them too. Fish are smart! (Which I know you know, preaching to the converted and all that )

[harpy]

I know, and it's really offpissing that people think it's OK to treat living creatures as a beauty aid I wonder if you could start a Facebook page to raise awareness of the problems, or has someone already done that? Or maybe post something on the Vegan Society FB page?

[Mymblesdaughter]

Looks like they are already banned in 14 states of America.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-0...nsanitary.html

Seems crazy that they have been considered a health hazard in America for a while but people are happily setting up the pedicures here.

[philfox]

Well, the good news is they are very quick to reply, the bad news is essentially 'they breed therefore they must be happy' standard reply you get from this sort of thing:

Thank you for your e-mail.



Please find a response below that was provided to us from the Company who offer these services:



At Orba Garra Spa the health of the fish and the highest standards of hygeine are our primary concern. Our Garraspas and maintenance procedures are designed to create optimal, humane living conditions for the Garra Rufa fish which originate from warm water mineral springs in Turkey where for centuries their diet has consisted of algae, phytoplantons and zooplanktons as well as a diet of dead skin.



We use reverse-osmosis, deionised and remineralised water which is constantly circulated and maintained at optimum temperature levels as well as UV sterilisation to kill bacteria.

As an extremely active species with a very high metabolism the fish survive on a constant diet, therefore our fish are fed every two days with high-nutrient vegetable-based supplements to ensure they remain healthy and thrive. We eliminate any risks of overfeeding as there are up to 120 fish in each GarraSpa, which allows the fish to rest when they want to, taking a break when they are full and swapping with the other fish whilst they feed.


Our fish will breed in our conditions reflecting that they have adapted very comfortably to the optimised environment of our systems which are maintained daily and attended to by our fully trained staff.



I hope this information answers any concerns you may have.



Thank you for contacting Superdrug.

[harpy]

Unfortunately I think most companies will essentially do whatever they can get away with that makes money. If consumers realise what's involved there may be less of a market for it though - perhaps.

[Clueless Git]

Well, I'm completely lost on this one ...

Can't see how being allowed to nibble peoples feet is going to harm the fish ...

Can't see how this worse (possibly it is better) than public/private ponds/aquariums for purely 'ornamental' use ...

The only objection I can see it that is must either involve wild capture or captive breeding of the species used and I have no idea at all what the damage ratings of either are.

M'personal opinion is that this one belongs way way down the list of possible fishy-welfare concerns.

Standing by to be educated further though!

[harpy]

Did you see the Observer article I posted to, CS? It has a comment on the welfare aspect.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...re?INTCMP=SRCH

In general a set-up like this is unlikely to priorities the needs of the animals and, as we now know, fish are quite intelligent and have specific social as well as physical needs.

There may well be worse forms of fish exploitation but OTOH there might be a chance to nip this new (to the UK) one in the bud.

[philfox]

My issue is the exploitation of animals for human use. And the fact they are over crowded in empty tanks. We wouldn't condone a pet goldfish in a tank, therefore these fish shouldn't be kept in tanks either, with far more per tank than people keep goldfish (who can't survive long in tanks, swimming in their own mess). I just get fed up of all of these fish spas in my city, and how many people really are going to look after them and offer enrichment to them?

[aye]

Interesting discussion, I personally just wouldnt use one as I feel it's animal exploitation - although I agree that there are many other far outrageous examples of this going on legally today - but I think there is the potential for cross contamination and I believe the Health Protection Agency were exploring this??
It just doesnt sit easy with me, I wonder how they are cared for, what the natural lifespan is and is it reduced from being used as a beauty product?
It's a small step in the wrong direction and glorifies the use and potential exploitation of animals - thats just my personal opinion though...

[Clueless Git]

'Lo Harpy, Phil ..

The Guardian article has moved to here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandsty...lbeing.health2, just in case anyone else wants to read it.

Personaly I am still of of the mind that, given the far greater profit driven abuses that are deemed perfectable acceptable by the hoi-poloi, that trying to deter anyone from making a buck out of this is flogging a dead horse.

I also think it is great that no matter how much of an uphill struggle it may be to raise challenges to peripheral animal exploitations like this one that someone (in this case our Phil) cares enough to have a go.

Phil, mucho respect you to matey and I'm sorry I can't think of anything that may be of any help.

On that note I'm off to investigate the possiblities of making some money out of using tanks of piranha fish as part of a rapid weight loss plan.