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Thread: What do vegans think about pets?

  1. #1
    dsmalex97
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    Default What do vegans think about pets?

    Hello!

    I have been looking into this lifestyle for quite sometime now, and just have some questions for you veteran veg heads! I only got one now but HERE IT IS!

    I am currently an owner of reptiles, and its something I hold very close to me. I love watching them, taking care of them, breeding them, teaching people about them, learning new housing/husbandry techniques, anything that comes with owning reptiles, i love. Now i know you guys stand very hard against pet stores, and things of that nature, and just animals in cages in general. Now being that these animals are CAPTIVE BRED which means not born in the wild, what supposed to happen to them, are they just thrown in the wild to fend for themselves? I am someone who takes great care of all my animals and I make sure they are as comfortable as possible. Is it really wrong to own animals as pets? I find it very theraputic handling reptiles(mostly snakes) and am going to have a hard time giving the hobby up, if I even can at all...Just wondering what all your thoughts are on this, thank you everyone who responds!

    P.S I don't believe in owning animals that are TOO large for enclosures. For example, a Burmese Python gets huge, and really is close to impossible to house comfortably in my opinion, in some situations I guess not, but most YES! So I am against certain animals that require lots of space to be kept as a pets, but heres the thing. Being that snakes are carniverous there body absorbs lots of toxins from the flesh and don't require lots of movement, in the wild they usually find a nice warm hide, and reside there as long as they can, moving around to find water and such. Now if I provide the nessacarey requirements for this, I personally do not see any harm, in fact, I feel that MY snakes know my presence, and know that I am a friend, and someone who helps keep them alive. So i dunno, tell me what you guys think!

    Peace&love
    ~Alex

  2. #2

    Default Re: What do vegans think about pets?

    Hi dsmalex97.
    Personally, I think that animals should be free.
    Since you keep snakes and other reptiles already and look after them well, then all well and good. If it were me I would not breed any more and phase out my reptile population as they die off.
    There are, for me, more useful ways of animal advocacy and adopting animals that need rescuing is a good place to start.
    You might want to find a way round the use of the word "own" too, for what it's worth.

    I think I've probably just about got across the fact that this is just my opinion...

    Peas Love Unity.
    x
    ..but what would they do with all the cows?..

  3. #3
    gorillagorilla Gorilla's Avatar
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    Default Re: What do vegans think about pets?

    there are already threads about this subject on the forum, have a look at those.
    'The word gorilla was derived from the Greek word Gorillai (a "tribe of hairy women")'

  4. #4
    VeganMonkey's Avatar
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    Default Re: What do vegans think about pets?

    Hi!
    My attitude towards this is the same as it would be with any type of pet - personally I'm totally against humans getting involved in the breeding process of animals (especially if making profit is involved - which I know may not be the case with you - it sounds like you keep the reptiles for your own interests). If I were you, I'd continue to care for the reptiles I have for the rest of their natural lives (obviously it would be cruel to realise them when they were born captive) but as horselesspaul says, I wouldn't bred any more. Meanwhile, you could research to see if there's a rescue centre near you which takes in unwanted pet reptiles which you could perhaps adopt and care for at your home. Or perhaps there's a centre which cares for injured wild reptiles until they can be realeased, in which case you could volunteer your time helping out with that. That way, you wouldn't have to give up your hobby but you're not breeding any more creatures into captivity.

  5. #5
    baffled harpy's Avatar
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    Default Re: What do vegans think about pets?

    Quote Gorilla View Post
    there are already threads about this subject on the forum, have a look at those.
    To see most of them you have to join the companion animals group which you can do from the user control panel (click "group memberships" on the menu down the left side of the panel).

    I have read that (in the UK anyway) there are quite a lot of unwanted captive reptiles that do need rescuing so that would be a good thing for an experienced reptile-keeper to do in future.

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    Default Re: What do vegans think about pets?

    Quote VeganMonkey View Post
    Meanwhile, you could research to see if there's a rescue centre near you which takes in unwanted pet reptiles which you could perhaps adopt and care for at your home. Or perhaps there's a centre which cares for injured wild reptiles until they can be realeased, in which case you could volunteer your time helping out with that. That way, you wouldn't have to give up your hobby but you're not breeding any more creatures into captivity.
    I think that's a really good idea. I wouldn't buy animals from people who breed them, because I don't want to support that. But we did adopt our cat from an animal shelter. I'm okay with this because it's a better life than he would otherwise have had. He'd been treated badly before we got him and was very timid - it's been wonderful to see him become more confident.

    And I think snakes are awesome as well, by the way

  7. #7
    burl's Avatar
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    Default Re: What do vegans think about pets?

    What do I think about pets? They're like kids, they're fine if they're not mine.
    Did I just say that? Damn, I did.
    pro-vegetable

  8. #8
    panic's Avatar
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    Default Re: What do vegans think about pets?

    personal opinion - it doesn't really matter how well you treat your animals, if you are breeding them for profit. Breeding more animals just contributes to that whole puppy mill (or I guess reptile mill, in this case) mentality. it would not be necessary to "let them fend for themselves" if breeders did not continue to breed new generations of animals that require care.

    There are hundreds of animals out there that could use a good home. By breeding or buying from breeders, you are contributing to overpopulation AND causing the death of at least one more animal that you could have saved from in humane euthanasia....

    Plus, I ADORE mice, and I think it's horrible to feed them to snakes or other reptiles. I know people argue that snakes are SUPPOSED to eat mice, it's only natural. But I'd argue that there is nothing "natural" about dangling a mouse over a reptiles cage where it has ZERO chance of survival.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: What do vegans think about pets?

    Quote dsmalex97 View Post
    I am currently an owner of reptiles, and its something I hold very close to me. I love watching them, taking care of them, breeding them, teaching people about them, learning new housing/husbandry techniques, anything that comes with owning reptiles, i love. Now i know you guys stand very hard against pet stores, and things of that nature, and just animals in cages in general. Now being that these animals are CAPTIVE BRED which means not born in the wild, what supposed to happen to them, are they just thrown in the wild to fend for themselves? I am someone who takes great care of all my animals and I make sure they are as comfortable as possible. Is it really wrong to own animals as pets? I find it very theraputic handling reptiles(mostly snakes) and am going to have a hard time giving the hobby up, if I even can at all...

    P.S I don't believe in owning animals that are TOO large for enclosures. For example, a Burmese Python gets huge, and really is close to impossible to house comfortably in my opinion, in some situations I guess not, but most YES! So I am against certain animals that require lots of space to be kept as a pets, but heres the thing. Being that snakes are carniverous there body absorbs lots of toxins from the flesh and don't require lots of movement, in the wild they usually find a nice warm hide, and reside there as long as they can, moving around to find water and such. Now if I provide the nessacarey requirements for this, I personally do not see any harm, in fact, I feel that MY snakes know my presence, and know that I am a friend, and someone who helps keep them alive. So i dunno, tell me what you guys think!
    Hi Alex,

    First of all, I´d like to point out that veganism is not just about not eating or wearing animals, it´s a philosophy about total respect for all living creatures. If you look at all the words I´ve highlighted within your text and you stop to think about them, but really think about them, you´ll see that your subconscious thoughts, probably without realising it, and like the thoughts of most people in the planet, are those of a slave trader or owner. Please read on, don´t feel offended yet (I hope you don´t feel offended full stop, as it´s not my intention to offend).

    If you stop to think about the words in a slightly-different context (different only in terms of species), and switch the picture in your mind and put humans, specifically yourself, in place of reptiles, you´ll see what I mean. In times of legal human slavery, people thought in the same way you think about "your" reptiles and didn´t think there was anything wrong with it, especially those who treated slaves more 'respectfully' than others (after all, they had bought them with their own money and 'bred' them themselves, what the hell!).

    To start with, "your" animals are not yours (only legally, but not morally), just like you´re not anybody´s animal either (thanks to the people who fought for the abolition of slavery), so the fact that you keep them indoors, out of their natural habitat, especially having bred them yourself for that purpose only (and for selfish reasons, even if you don´t realise your reasons are selfish and even if don´t mean it), means they´re your slaves (I know you don´t see it that way now, but please try, think outside the box, so to speak).

    You say they know your presence and that you´re a friend, but if they could speak and you opened their prison door and asked them what they´d like to do, I´m quite sure they wouldn´t stay inside and say "Hey, no, don´t worry about it man! We´re fine, really, we know you´re our friend, leave it clooosed, don´t be sillyyyy! Anyway, you´re the one who has to decide about our lives, being as you paid for them! Naah, honestly, leave it!"

    About them being animals which are "captively bred, and what are you supposed to do, throw them out in the wild to fend for themselves", well, no!! Just stop breeding them!! Don´t be a link in the chain of over-population and start rescuing instead! Like Panic said below, "There are hundreds of animals out there that could use a good home. By breeding or buying from breeders, you are contributing to overpopulation AND causing the death of at least one more animal that you could have saved from inhumane euthanasia...." Switching myself off from the vegan way of thinking for a second, I can understand how you find them therapeutic, but again, this is about you, and not about them, they´re there for your own use. You´re not breeding them because you think their species is in danger and you want to prevent their extintion, and you´re certainly not breeding them cause you think that by being born captive and living a prisoner's life they´re going to be really happy animals. You say you make sure they´re as comfortable as possible, but the best life for any creature is a free life. As slaves, they´re under your control, whether they like it or not.

    You say you don´t believe in owning animals that are too large for their enclosure... (think about the word 'enclosure' and what it means too)... Well, where do you draw the line? Who decides? Each person has their own criteria. It´s certainly not the animal who decides, as the animal would choose to be free, just like we would. You also say snakes are carnivorous... as such, you are sentencing other animals to death, as you have to feed them mice and other animals who also deserve to be free and not be killed. Vegans would not kill to feed themselves, so why kill to feed others? Always put yourself in the animal´s shoes, whether mouse, reptile, cow, lamb, pig, bee... see yourself in their place, in the case of a mouse about to be eaten by a snake which is only there to amuse its keeper and for no other purpose... see yourself about to be engulfed but the snake, your life about to end, and for what! So a person can be soothed by watching them and stroking them...? It doesn´t seem very fair...

    Each and every reptile (and mouse, and all other animals) is an individual, and each and every one of their lives is as unique and important as the next, and in fact, it´s all they have, just one life. They´re not a collective so that if the life of one of them ends, "well, there´s always another one", no. One life is all they get. When one more animal is captively-bred, another one waiting to be rescued from a life of mysery is automatically sentenced to death (the equation is always the same, always one life for another, and the abandoned individuals 'living' in shelters didn´t choose that kind of life, or to be killed if nobody saves them). If one is waiting to be rescued (many in really bad conditions) and a fairly good life can be given to that individual who´s waiting, why breed another one when you can save the one waiting and get them out of their mysery? The one who hasn´t been born yet will never know, cause until someone decides they should breed, they don´t even exist!!

    I urge you to study the words I´ve highlighted in your text. You´ll see they´re all about you and how you feel, and about owning and controlling. And please don´t feel offended, as, again, I´m not trying to offend you, I´m just trying to make you see something you´ve probably never seen before, and I´m not blaming you either because human animals are conditioned from day 1 of our lives to use animals, and are taught that it´s OK to do so. To get out of that way of thinking takes a little sparkle which suddenly appears in your consciousness and which, if investigaged, will eventually turn into the brightest light you´ve ever seen, and your thoughts will be independent of the influence of those who don´t care about others, and your life will change forever (and the lives of those who, until then, were under your control).

    Thanks for reading me, thanks for posting the question, and please, I repeat, don´t get offended. I wasn´t born a vegan and until then and in my ignorance I have also harmed many animals. We all start somewhere.

    Peace.

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