Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 67

Thread: What's the real definition for vegetarian and vegan?

  1. #1
    TheHRchannel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    65

    Default What's the real definition for vegetarian and vegan?

    There were arguments that vegan is when someone is on a 100% plant based diet.
    There were arguments that vegetarian is when someone doesn't eat meat but still eats animal product like milk and eggs.

    I thought vegans were those who are on a 100% plant based diet AND exclude other stuff like fur, leather, products tested on animals, and etc and that vegetarians are those who are on a 100% plant based diet but still wear animal clothing or so.

  2. #2

    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    44

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Veganism is the practice of eliminating the use of animal products.Ethical vegans reject the commodity status of animals and the use of animal products for any purpose, while dietary vegans or strict vegetarians eliminate them from their diet only.[1] Another form,environmental veganism, rejects the use of animal products on the premise that the industrial practice is environmentally damaging and unsustainable.
    While Wikipedia isn't always the best source, this is how I'd always understood it. Vegetarian as a diet, vegan as a lifestyle.

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Lentils
    Posts
    82

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Vegetarian: Doesn't eat meat.

    Strict Vegetarian: Doesn't eat meat or any other animal products, people have started using the strange term 'dietary vegan' to mean this also.

    Vegan: Eats the same diet as a Strict Vegetarian but has more of a belief and philosophy behind it which applies to things other than diet as well, you can't be Vegan if animal welfare and such aren't very core reasons behind your dietary restrictions.

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Petaling Jaya, Malaysia
    Posts
    772

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    ... and an Abolitionist Vegan would be somebody who tries to end use of animals for all purposes, e.g. food, clothing or entertainment.

    Best regards,
    Andy

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Lentils
    Posts
    82

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Don't all vegans want that? o.o

  6. #6

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    331

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    From the vegan society (UK):

    Veganism is a way of living that seeks to exclude, as far as possible and practicable, all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing and any other purpose
    It doesn't matter if you are vegan for your health, ethical reasons, environmental reasons... that is what veganism is. Modifiers like "dietary vegans" can not mean anything less. Following a vegan diet only does not make you a dietary vegan. If you only care for any health aspects but still use animals for other purposes you are not a vegan, you are on a vegan diet.


    From the vegetarian society (UK):

    The Vegetarian Society defines a vegetarian as: "Someone who lives on a diet of grains, pulses, nuts, seeds, vegetables and fruits with, or without, the use of dairy products and eggs. A vegetarian does not eat any meat, poultry, game, fish, shellfish* or by-products of slaughter."

    There are different types of vegetarian:
    * Lacto-ovo-vegetarians eat both dairy products and eggs; this is the most common type of vegetarian diet.
    * Lacto-vegetarians eat dairy products but avoid eggs.

  7. #7

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    331

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote Maître View Post
    Don't all vegans want that? o.o
    Some people try to redefine "vegan" to mean:
    - eating honey
    - being a diet only

    We need to stand firm and keep the intended definition so we don't end up with ovo-lacto-vegan shit or "vegan" for short !

  8. #8
    VeganAthlete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    266

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote Maître View Post

    Vegan: Eats the same diet as a Strict Vegetarian but has more of a belief and philosophy behind it which applies to things other than diet as well, you can't be Vegan if animal welfare and such aren't very core reasons behind your dietary restrictions.
    Agreed. Many people (researchers and professionals included) use the term 'dietary vegan' or refer to 'vegan diet' to refer to individuals who follow a plant-based diet (usually for health reasons) but don't necessarily have the condemn the abuse and suffering of animals.

    Vegan(ism) is not solely limited to diet, but rather extends beyond what one eats and is concerned over the welfare of animals and the environment. It wouldn't be very 'vegan' to follow a plant-based diet and then go to work with a huge D&G leather bag and GUCCI leather shoes. A strict vegetarian or a 'dietary vegan' would.

    Excellent question!
    Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace (Schweitzer, 1952)

  9. #9

  10. #10
    VeganAthlete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    266

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote CoolCat View Post
    We need to stand firm and keep the intended definition so we don't end up with ovo-lacto-vegan shit or "vegan" for short !
    Riight on!

    I like their definition. This is the american vegan society (US) definition:
    The vegan diet excludes flesh, fish, fowl, dairy products (animal milk, butter, cheese, yogurt, etc.), eggs, honey, animal gelatin, and all other foods of animal origin. It is an adventure in taste; and displays an amazing variety, the fundamentals of which are vegetables, grains, fruits, legumes, nuts and seeds. Foods from plants best provide for all people in the world.

    Vegans exclude products of cruelty such as leather, wool, fur, and silk, in clothing, upholstery, etc. They dress with care. Fashion with compassion is the style.
    Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace (Schweitzer, 1952)

  11. #11

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Petaling Jaya, Malaysia
    Posts
    772

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote Maître View Post
    Don't all vegans want that? o.o
    That is a very good question!

    When I look at many campaigns I see, it seems that many people (vegans and non-vegans alike) seem to be happy with ending "cruelty to animals", e.g. factory farms.

    However, campaigning against factory farms, debeaking of hens, gestation crates, life exports and more of the horrific symptomps of animal agriculture implies that "sustainable farms", "free range eggs", "freedom foods" and whatever euphemistic names are thought up are ok - which they are not.

    Best regards,
    Andy

    PS: I have another one: "Veganish".

    That's a person who does not eat animal products as long as it is not too difficult, insensitive or inconvenient.

    Like, when your grandmother (or friend, office colleague etc.) makes a non-vegan birthday cake and you feel they would be deeply hurt by you not eating it.

    Or when you are eating out with omni friends and do not want to offend them. Or when you are feeling hungry and there is no vegan food around ... and so on ... then you can make a teeny weeny exception.

    (You don't have to worry about sending the wrong messages to omnis, just as long as you do not get caught by the "Vegan Police" who will then insult you as a non-vegan, although you really only make some small exceptions now and then )

  12. #12
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote CoolCat View Post
    Personally I don't like when vegan is thrown in with religion but it makes the point.
    I think in one way, veganism is comparable to a religion, CoolCat. Just as I can't prove there's a God, it's just a matter of faith, so I can't prove why it's ethically right to be concerned about the plight of animals and their suffering. My concern just seems to be right, it's a matter of faith, it's a belief. Fortunately, in making a case for going vegan, I can point to the benefits for health, the environment, the economy and so on.

    Leedsveg

  13. #13

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    331

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote leedsveg View Post
    I think in one way, veganism is comparable to a religion, CoolCat. Just as I can't prove there's a God, it's just a matter of faith, so I can't prove why it's ethically right to be concerned about the plight of animals and their suffering. My concern just seems to be right, it's a matter of faith, it's a belief. Fortunately, in making a case for going vegan, I can point to the benefits for health, the environment, the economy and so on.

    Leedsveg
    There are court rulings from Californian courts stating that veganism isn't a religion though. If we can't have the legal benefits from being a religion I don't want stigmas or other crap of it either.

  14. #14
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote Andy_T View Post
    PS: I have another one: "Veganish".

    That's a person who does not eat animal products as long as it is not too difficult, insensitive or inconvenient.

    Like, when your grandmother (or friend, office colleague etc.) makes a non-vegan birthday cake and you feel they would be deeply hurt by you not eating it.

    Or when you are eating out with omni friends and do not want to offend them. Or when you are feeling hungry and there is no vegan food around ... and so on ... then you can make a teeny weeny exception.

    (You don't have to worry about sending the wrong messages to omnis, just as long as you do not get caught by the "Vegan Police" who will then insult you as a non-vegan, although you really only make some small exceptions now and then )
    Hi Andy
    If veganism is more than "not eating animals", then would eating a piece of your grandmother-made birthday cake that has a minute amount of a non-vegan ingredient, be any worse than sitting in a leather covered seat on a train journey?

    Leedsveg

  15. #15
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote CoolCat View Post
    There are court rulings from Californian courts stating that veganism isn't a religion though. If we can't have the legal benefits from being a religion I don't want stigmas or other crap of it either.
    I think it would be hard to classify veganism as a religion since vegans don't necessarily believe in a supernatural entity. But we do have unprovable, ethical beliefs about animals. Why people with unprovable religious beliefs should have legal benefits over people with unprovable ethical beliefs about animals, does not seem logical to me. I'm not understanding where stigma comes into this, to be honest?

    Leedsveg

  16. #16
    VeganAthlete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    266

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote leedsveg View Post
    That's a person who does not eat animal products as long as it is not too difficult, insensitive or inconvenient.
    Uh, ummm this doesn't really qualify someone as vegan or following a 'vegan diet', does it?
    That's like someone going vegan because they don't want to bother purchasing eggs, dairy, meats, etc. I can understand someone feeling bad about offending someone, but I think most people would understand the motives of your conviction. Most family members and friends will pick on me for being "picky" during a cookout or a dinner because I am not eating what they cooked or baked. I usually just tell them that I prepared my own food before hand because I am vegan and don't want to inconvenience them into making separate food for me. Similarly, I'll bring my own pasties, cookies, cake or cupcake and offer them some. The veganish concept you mention is a little deceptive. Interesting to learn about, but not very vegan.

    Leedsveg: You're on a philosophical train ride! Ethics, morals, values and religion alike can be very controversial (definitely topics you want to avoid at the dinner table). I think CoolCat is referring to the stigma placed on individual vegans by the "Vegan Police" and judgmental members of society, am I correct?
    Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace (Schweitzer, 1952)

  17. #17
    Crusty Rat
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    "Veganish" is better than full-on carnist, but it does somewhat miss the point. Veganism isn't something to be quiet and ashamed about - whilst I often feel anxious, I think most conversations about veganism are worthwhile. Provided the person isn't totally closed-minded you're gonna make them think a bit and make the concept of veganism seem less alien. Also, if there's no vegan food about, wouldn't you want to change it rather than supporting the current state of affairs?

  18. #18

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    331

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote leedsveg View Post
    I'm not understanding where stigma comes into this, to be honest?
    Quote VeganAthlete View Post
    I think CoolCat is referring to the stigma placed on individual vegans by the "Vegan Police" and judgmental members of society, am I correct?
    No religious people are often thought of as nutjobs, crazy fundamentalist or gullable people of low intelligence etc. If we can't have the legal benefits (vegan holidays, government subsidizing,...) then I'd rather keep veganism far away from religion. Also I'm sure you can find vegans having/following any of the widespread religions. If veganism would be considered a religion it would compete with the others, not be an addition to them. People tend to choose a religion or are forced into one by their upbringing, bireligious people are unheard of I think. I think I talked enough about religion for a while, I feel itchy and think I'm developing a rash. I'm kinda allergic to religions

  19. #19
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    That's a person who does not eat animal products as long as it is not too difficult, insensitive or inconvenient.
    VeganAthlete. You ascribed the above quote to me but I think you'll find it was Andy_T who actually said it.

    CoolCat. I don't believe that Joanne Stepaniak was really linking veganism with Catholicism or Judaism. She was only using aspects of those religions to make a point (that both you and I agree with) about veganism. She could equally have talked about somebody who wore an Oxford University scarf in the mistaken belief (of the wearer) that this automatically turned them into an Oxford University student. From what you say about religion, I can appreciate that your antipathy towards it, is pretty strong.

    Leedsveg

  20. #20

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    331

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote leedsveg View Post
    VeganAthlete. You ascribed the above quote to me but I think you'll find it was Andy_T who actually said it.

    CoolCat. I don't believe that Joanne Stepaniak was really linking veganism with Catholicism or Judaism. She was only using aspects of those religions to make a point (that both you and I agree with) about veganism. She could equally have talked about somebody who wore an Oxford University scarf in the mistaken belief (of the wearer) that this automatically turned them into an Oxford University student. From what you say about religion, I can appreciate that your antipathy towards it, is pretty strong.

    Leedsveg

    To bad this is "only" a forum and not print. Otherwise we could update the wiki article because yours is better.
    Wikipedians seem to insist that people who print their opinions have more value than others. Elitists bastards

  21. #21
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    ^^^I do like Joanne Stepaniak though and her book Being Vegan is my favourite vegan book. Her ideas on veganism and compassion seem to correspond with what we know about the ethics of Donald Watson.

    Good wishes

    Leedsveg

  22. #22

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Petaling Jaya, Malaysia
    Posts
    772

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote CoolCat View Post
    There are court rulings from Californian courts stating that veganism isn't a religion though. If we can't have the legal benefits from being a religion I don't want stigmas or other crap of it either.
    No problem, you can always simply become a Jain.
    Then you can rightfully and legally claim that consuming non-vegan items is against your religious beliefs.

    Best regards,
    Andy

  23. #23

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Petaling Jaya, Malaysia
    Posts
    772

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote leedsveg View Post
    Hi Andy
    If veganism is more than "not eating animals", then would eating a piece of your grandmother-made birthday cake that has a minute amount of a non-vegan ingredient, be any worse than sitting in a leather covered seat on a train journey?

    Leedsveg
    Leedsveg, I do not see it that way (and I did give it some serious thought). Most of the times, there is no way to escape sitting on a leather-covered seat in a train or airplane, if they only have these, or driving with your car on a road made with animal ingredients, other than not to travel. (I'm lucky in Germany, because they only have leather upholstery in "first class" trains, "second class" which I use for cost reasons only has plush upholstery ;-) ).

    I never had troubles, however, escaping eating a cake made with eggs and dairy. I guess the people who offered it to me would be more surprised if I ate it "as an exception" and then claimed to "normally" be vegan and not eat any animal products because the plight of animals is important to me. The next thing to offer might then be "just this one steak, c'mon, it really tastes good ... just this time" and so on.

    I had the example actually from the discussion of this article here, which I find troubling: http://www.carpevegan.com/?page_id=352

    Best regards,
    Andy

  24. #24

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Petaling Jaya, Malaysia
    Posts
    772

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote VeganAthlete View Post
    Uh, ummm this doesn't really qualify someone as vegan or following a 'vegan diet', does it?
    That's like someone going vegan because they don't want to bother purchasing eggs, dairy, meats, etc. I can understand someone feeling bad about offending someone, but I think most people would understand the motives of your conviction. Most family members and friends will pick on me for being "picky" during a cookout or a dinner because I am not eating what they cooked or baked. I usually just tell them that I prepared my own food before hand because I am vegan and don't want to inconvenience them into making separate food for me. Similarly, I'll bring my own pasties, cookies, cake or cupcake and offer them some. The veganish concept you mention is a little deceptive. Interesting to learn about, but not very vegan.
    VA, you are absolutely spot on. Mind you, I do not have a problem with people eating meat, fish, dairy and eggs only once in a while - that's better than eating those products for every meal.

    I just would not want that they call themselves vegans, if they are not.

    Best regards,
    Andy

  25. #25
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Andy_T, I totally understand what you're saying. For me though, things are not always clearcut. I think I may have previously mentioned that my mother once made me a casserole using Beanfeast which probably contained half a spoonful of powdered milk. Now I could have kept to "the letter of the law of veganism", refused to eat it and upset a 91 year old woman. I chose to eat it though which seemed the more compassionate thing to do and more in line with "the spirit of veganism".

    I also recently chose to have the flu-jab (for those 65+) although I understood that the vacine culture is grown in hen's eggs. Other vegans may have chosen not to have the jab potentially causing harm to their own health, as well as to the health of other older people they were in contact with. As the writer Joanne Stepaniak says in her book, veganism is about "Do[ing] the least harm and the most good". It's up to us as individuals to determine what that means for us personally when we put that into practice. I can well understand the "slippery slope argument" but if we turn veganism into going to extreme lenghts "to avoid ingesting a grain of animal product", then we risk coming over as pharisaic.

    Cheers

    Leedsveg
    Last edited by leedsveg; Nov 10th, 2011 at 03:07 PM. Reason: added flu-jab comment

  26. #26
    baffled harpy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    6,655

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    IME discussions about who's really entitled to call themselves a vegan don't go anywhere. It seems more productive to talk about which products and practices can be regarded as vegan, then people feel encouraged to do their best rather than discouraged because they don't measure up.

    Having said that, I would like to say that nobody should call themselves vegan unless they have been trying to be one, however imperfectly, for at least (calculates) 17 years

  27. #27
    VeganAthlete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    266

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote Andy_T View Post
    I do not have a problem with people eating meat, fish, dairy and eggs only once in a while - that's better than eating those products for every meal.

    I just would not want that they call themselves vegans, if they are not.
    Andy, I definitely agree. A reduction of meat and animal consumption is much better than over consumption of meat at every meal. Some people can't have a meal without there being meat, cheese or eggs present. Most nutritionists warn against that anyway.

    I've actually heard people say "I am vegan/vegetarian Monday through Friday." I SERIOUSLY do not understand this concept. It's like saying I am a good parents Monday through Thursday. In my eyes, if you are a 'vegan' Monday through Friday, you are NOT vegan. Similarly, if you are a good parent Monday though Thursday, you are not a good parent. I know it may sound extreme, but exceptions and disclaimers dilute the concept of what it means to be vegan.

    Like Leedsveg mentions, there are times when we are pressed between wall and sword. I don't know how I would react if a 90 year old cooked for me and made me eat in front of them. I am guessing I would pick around and ask for tea, water, fruit to 'accompany' my meal and then just eat that.

    Back to the original question:
    The definition of veganism and vegetarianism is pretty clear and concise, but individuals exercise the vegan lifestyle differently. It is difficult to make generalizations and have certainty that all vegans are the same. Most of us have adapted veganism into our lifestyle differently. Some of us are more strict than others. Some of us became vegans for different reasons. Some of us find it more 'difficult' than others. Some of us may be more particular about macro-nutrients than other. I could go on and on.
    Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace (Schweitzer, 1952)

  28. #28
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    ^^^
    Oh dear, another 2 years to go for me harpy.

    Lv

  29. #29
    baffled harpy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    6,655

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    You'll get there in the end, lad.

    90 year olds aren't stupid, they're just 90, so they would probably notice if you didn't eat the food, VA!

  30. #30
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote VeganAthlete View Post
    I know it may sound extreme, but exceptions and disclaimers dilute the concept of what it means to be vegan.
    Does that mean that you would not take a non-vegan medicine, even to save your own life VA?

    Lv

  31. #31
    VeganAthlete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    266

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote harpy View Post
    90 year olds aren't stupid, they're just 90, so they would probably notice if you didn't eat the food, VA!
    That is funny, but true! Good point :P I suppose nibbling might help. Leedsveg probably did the smartest thing and just deal with it to avoid hurting his mum's feelings. My family is usually to distracted telling stories or worrying about other stuff that they wouldn't pay attention, but who knows how they'll be in the long run!
    Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace (Schweitzer, 1952)

  32. #32
    VeganAthlete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    266

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote leedsveg View Post
    Does that mean that you would not take a non-vegan medicine, even to save your own life VA?
    That is a tough question. Early on during puberty or something, I did get vaccinated while I was vegetarian. I was not as strict as I am now. I do avoid taking medications in general. I resort to healers or holistic medication when need be (my entire family is that way, so it's more of an upbringing thing too). I am not in that position and have never given it much thought. But when it came down to it, I would do whatever it took to save my life. I would not be able to be as active in my community as I am if I were not on Earth. I guess I'd have to make an exception that one time if it meant doing the most good and causing the least harm. The good would outweight the bad.

    Cognitive flexibility is pretty darn important, and sometimes we have to take a step back and really think about situations such as these. Good question Leedsveg!

    Let's hope we all enjoy a long and healthy life
    Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace (Schweitzer, 1952)

  33. #33
    VeganAthlete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    266

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Congrats Harpy & LV! It must feel awesome to know that you've been vegan for so long! Almost two decades for both of you!!! If I had become vegan 17 years ago, I would have started before I even started grade school :P
    Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace (Schweitzer, 1952)

  34. #34
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    ^^^
    Thanks VeganAthlete. Being vegan is the most natural thing in the world and I just wish I'd done it many years sooner, rather than waiting until I was 50.

    I hate having to go to the doctors, I always feel such a failure and that I should be able to heal myself naturally. Anyway good health and a long life to you mate!


    Leedsveg

  35. #35
    baffled harpy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    6,655

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    I think we all wish we'd done it sooner. I don't see why we should feel guilty about going to the doctor though - even if you assume vegans are healthier on average it's not a miracle cure for everything. (Though I must admit I only go to see mine if it's completely unavoidable )

  36. #36
    amethyst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Ohio, USA
    Posts
    102

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote AaronM View Post
    Vegetarian as a diet, vegan as a lifestyle.
    Wow, Aaron. That should be a bumper sticker! LOL (Maybe it is, I didn't check.)

    That one sentence simply defines what made me change from vegetarian to vegan this year. After all of those years of occasional eggs in a cake or bread, or honey in my tea, I finally woke up to what I was doing. Telling myself that an occasional non-flesh animal product was not hurting the world that much.......well, let's just say that I am sorry and wish I had had my eyes opened a long time ago.

    Your post jumped off the 'page' for me. It's nice to be on the lifestyle side now, rather than the diet side. I still obsess over what I am eating, but I also obsess over where the products come from that I buy, and what atrocities are being made against animals in general. It really is a lifestyle. A life changer.

  37. #37
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote harpy View Post
    I don't see why we should feel guilty about going to the doctor though - even if you assume vegans are healthier on average it's not a miracle cure for everything.)
    I agree harpy, which is why I related it only to myself. It's part of my wonky way of thinking (although it's not helped by the general low regard I have for the health service).

    Lv

  38. #38
    TheHRchannel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    65

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote leedsveg View Post
    Does that mean that you would not take a non-vegan medicine, even to save your own life VA?

    Lv
    Because people who only eat plant tend to be a lot healthier than meat eaters, they should rarely be in a situation where they have to worry about what's inside the medicine.

  39. #39
    TheHRchannel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    65

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    I started this because there was a vegetarian page on facebook that post about cruelty and health issues about milk and eggs and people accuse the page as "miscategorized" and argued that the vegetarian page is not a "vegan" page. I never seen the page post about the cruelty of fur, leather, animal testing, and etc.

  40. #40

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    331

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote TheHRchannel View Post
    I started this because there was a vegetarian page on facebook that post about cruelty and health issues about milk and eggs and people accuse the page as "miscategorized" and argued that the vegetarian page is not a "vegan" page. I never seen the page post about the cruelty of fur, leather, animal testing, and etc.
    Shows how much vegetarians really care for ethics. They rather debate not having to read that they are wrong than make a change.

  41. #41
    VeganAthlete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    266

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    I find that so very odd. I became veggie once I turned 10...vegetarian first then vegan. My family thought I was a little off for not eating meats and milk because of the animal cruelty behind it. I didn't budge and become vegan till I was in my mid-teens, but I still cared for ethics. Just didn't have control over groceries and foods as much as I would have liked anyway.

    Why do you guys think vegetarians are not as assertive/caring about ethics. That's a very interesting finding HRChannel...what a freakin' weird vegetarian facebook page!
    Until he extends the circle of his compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace (Schweitzer, 1952)

  42. #42
    TheHRchannel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    65

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote VeganAthlete View Post
    I find that so very odd. I became veggie once I turned 10...vegetarian first then vegan. My family thought I was a little off for not eating meats and milk because of the animal cruelty behind it. I didn't budge and become vegan till I was in my mid-teens, but I still cared for ethics. Just didn't have control over groceries and foods as much as I would have liked anyway.

    Why do you guys think vegetarians are not as assertive/caring about ethics. That's a very interesting finding HRChannel...what a freakin' weird vegetarian facebook page!
    I don't see anything weird about the page but I do wish that people, who are in this for ethical issue, would stop trying to avoid the fact that milk and eggs are just as cruel as meat.

  43. #43
    Ladygold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Canada, Edmonton
    Posts
    120

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    I just saw a t-shirt and wanted to share the slogan, seems to fit the topic a little

    When vegetarians grow up
    they become vegans.

    http://www.cafepress.com/overtheedge...m_term=2071084

    LG
    If you don't stick to your values when they're being tested, they're not values—they're hobbies. ~ Jon Stewart .

  44. #44
    TheHRchannel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    65

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote Ladygold View Post
    I just saw a t-shirt and wanted to share the slogan, seems to fit the topic a little

    When vegetarians grow up
    they become vegans.

    http://www.cafepress.com/overtheedge...m_term=2071084

    LG
    I prefer wearing a shirt like this because they send some good messages. http://www.nonviolenceunited.org/veganshirt.html

  45. #45
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote TheHRchannel View Post
    Because people who only eat plant tend to be a lot healthier than meat eaters, they should rarely be in a situation where they have to worry about what's inside the medicine.
    "A lot healthier"? "Rarely"?

    Not my experience THRc, but it's 0045am and this old geezer needs his sleep, so I'll leave it at that.

    Leedsveg

  46. #46

    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Chiang Mai Thailand
    Posts
    28

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Vegans avoid all animal products. They don't eat eggs or dairy products.

    Fruitarians eat only fruits, seeds, nuts, and other plants that can be harvested without harming the plant.

    Lacto-vegetarians eat dairy products.

    Lacto-ovo vegetarians eat both eggs and dairy products. This is what the majority of vegetarians are.

    Pesce-vegetarians eat fish.

    Pollo-vegetarians eat, chicken and turkey, quail, duck, etc. but avoid red meat and pork.

    Flexitarians mainly eat vegetarian food, but are flexible and willing to make exceptions.

    Hers is a link to some other eating habit descriptions: Types of Vegetarians

    Also keep in mind that not all people are vegetarians or vegans for ethical reasons.
    Last edited by ChrisF; Nov 16th, 2011 at 03:21 AM. Reason: typo

  47. #47

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    331

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote ChrisF View Post
    [...]
    Also keep in mind that not all people are [...] vegans for ethical reasons.
    There is a big difference between being vegan and following a vegan diet.

    If you are vegan and don't wear leather, silk, wool or don't visit the zoo or the circus, I can't see a reason not to that isn't rooted in ethics. Doing a vegan diet only is not the same as being vegan because like you said vegans avoid animal products [the more correct description would be avoid animal exploitation though] and a focus on the diet part only obviously doesn't agree with that.


    I think we shouldn't redefine, or recap the definition when the Vegan Society has it all in one line:

    Veganism is a way of living that seeks to exclude, as far as possible and practicable, all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing and any other purpose

  48. #48
    leedsveg
    Guest

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote CoolCat View Post
    There is a big difference between being vegan and following a vegan diet.

    I think we shouldn't redefine, or recap the definition when the Vegan Society has it all in one line:
    I agree CC.

    Leedsveg

  49. #49

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Petaling Jaya, Malaysia
    Posts
    772

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    In my opinion, there are no pesco-vegetarians and no pollo-vegetarians, those are commonly referred to as omnivores.
    I also do not believe in "part time vegetarians" ... those who do not eat any meat between breakfast and lunch, e.g.

    Best regards,
    Andy

  50. #50
    Ladygold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Canada, Edmonton
    Posts
    120

    Default Re: What's the real defenition for vegetarian and vegan?

    Quote Andy_T View Post
    In my opinion, there are no pesco-vegetarians and no pollo-vegetarians, those are commonly referred to as omnivores.
    I also do not believe in "part time vegetarians" ... those who do not eat any meat between breakfast and lunch, e.g.

    Best regards,
    Andy
    I completely agree with you vegetarian should at least mean herbivore and fish contrary to what some people think are not plants!!!!

    Its pretty obvious that many people want to use the names vegetarian or vegan but are not willing to do the work.

    LG
    If you don't stick to your values when they're being tested, they're not values—they're hobbies. ~ Jon Stewart .

Similar Threads

  1. The definition of vegan
    By Korn in forum QUESTIONS FROM NON-VEGANS
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: Nov 20th, 2011, 10:45 AM
  2. Ask your MEP to vote for a EU wide legal definition of the word vegan
    By Mr Flibble in forum LOCAL FORUMS AND TRAVELING
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: Feb 26th, 2010, 08:23 PM
  3. The definition of vegan
    By ConsciousCuisine in forum VEGANISM - THE MAIN TOPICS
    Replies: 118
    Last Post: Jan 29th, 2008, 10:34 PM
  4. Definition of a vegan
    By Jamila in forum QUESTIONS FROM NON-VEGANS
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: Oct 15th, 2007, 07:59 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •