Guide dogs

[curiousnonvegan]

Exploitation or a useful/enjoyable collaboration? what do you think?

[CoolCat]

How are police dogs not exploited? They are deliberately put in harms way for our benefit. They are trained to find things like drugs and explosives, or to be used in protests/riots/soccer games fights. There is a HUGE difference between playing fetch with a companion dog or doing some agility games with them and a working dog.

You can't selectively breed domesticated animals for our purposes and then claim "they enjoy work"... it is very much exploitation.

[Blue moon]

How are police dogs not exploited? They are deliberately put in harms way for our benefit. They are trained to find things like drugs and explosives, or to be used in protests/riots/soccer games fights. There is a HUGE difference between playing fetch with a companion dog or doing some agility games with them and a working dog.

You can't selectively breed domesticated animals for our purposes and then claim "they enjoy work"... it is very much exploitation.

Agreed, the dogs with the wrecked paws from being made to walk on glass and having stuff thrown at them during the riots... they should NOT have been put into that situation.

I would say guide dogs are also exploited, they do not (usually) stay with their person for life, they are retired and replaced. They aren't pets, they are used as tools first and foremost, and if they are loved for a while so be it. Yes I know people will say they love them, but that isn't their main purpose and the way their lives go from months of training to placement then retirement is not like a Companion.

[CoolCat]

If you breed an animal into captivity for a purpose that benefits you then you are exploiting that animal. Symbiosis ended a long time ago when we started to treat animals as commodities that can be bred, sold, used and disposed of as we pleases.


Police officers CHOOSE for the jobs, dogs CAN'T. How is police working dogs a grey area? It's endangerment of slaves.
We shouldn't be breeding dogs, all what comes after that is obvious exploitation.

[CoolCat]

By that argument, any of my pets is being exploited. They were bred in captivity to benefit humans with companionship.

Yes they are. Pets are bred to make a profit. A lot of pets end up in bad situations, shelters, neglected, or killed. The pet industry is horrible. If you want to take care of companion animals rescue them from shelters. Don't buy animals from breeders or pet shops, and don't breed them yourself.

Breeding animals in captivity doesn't benefit the animal. Not breeding the animal in the first place is the only solution that make sense when you have shelters full of animals looking for a home.

You honesty think war dogs aren't used in an abusive way? These innocent animals are used in our WARS... how can that be justified by treating the ones that make it out alive as heroes.

Are you a dog breeder by any chance ?

[jcw720]

As someone who actually work for Guide Dogs for the Blind, i can assure that you that you cannot force a dog to 'guide'. Dogs are naturally willing to please and dogs are trained using repetition and reward. Most working guide dogs only work for a short period of time during the day, for the rest of the day they are a pet/companion. Dogs are retired when they become older and require a slower pace of life. IN most cases the dogs remain within the family as a pet while the v isually impaired person retrains with a younger dog. If the guide dog owner is unable to keep the animal as it would be detremental to the dogs quality of life, the dog will be rehomed to a carefully selected family where the dog will end its days. In some cases the bond between animal and man is so strong that if the blind person is unable to care for a retired and young dog, they will not retrain with a new animal until the old dog dies.
These dogs are not forced to work, they are using natural abilities to help people.

[Blue moon]

No, I'm not, but I do believe dogs want to have a purpose. They exist beside us, not below us. While I certainly approve of choosing shelter animals over specially bred animals, there are plenty of good breeders. These are domesticated animals, not ones that are wild that can't handle "captivity". There is a big difference. Also, most of the petshops in my area adopt out animals, they don't breed them. Plenty of petshops are responsible in this way.

I don't really think dogs should be in a war, because I don't believe anyone should be. But police dogs are certainly not exploited. They serve as productive citizens of our society, just like humans. The same goes with guide and therapy dogs. Is that exploitation?

Arguments about the rights or wrongs of breeders and breeding aside, I take issue with "They serve as productive citizens of our society, just like humans." Um, no, humans have choices, and a whole wealth of rights that dogs don't.

Back to the original question, a pretty good definition of exploitation I've found: Utilization of another person or group for selfish purposes. So yes, it is exploitation.

[harpy]

I think the use of guidedogs probably is exploitation in that it is done for the benefit of humans rather than dogs and the dogs' interests seem to come second. However I feel it is one of the more benign forms of exploitation so I personally can't get that worked up over it.

I also think it's a temporary situation as automated solutions are likely to be available, and preferable, soon for this and many other situations where working animals are currently used. Blind people could still have companion dogs if they wanted to of course. http://www.shu.ac.uk/research/meri/n...tic-guide-dogs (A potential problem for guide dog charities may be that the dog angle brings in a lot of donations and robots might not be so "sexy" - but who knows.)

[Mymblesdaughter]

There were two separate incidents of police officers leaving their dogs in cars last year in really hot weather all of the dogs died. I don't imagine they would have done this to their human colleagues.

I don't agree there are good breeders. Some might be ignorant but that's not really an excuse. I believe for every animal you get from a breeder an animal in a shelter dies. If you go and work at a shelter for a while you will realise the overwhelming problem that exists. Although I knew it was a difficult situation, until I actually went there it really hadn't sunk in how truly desperate the situation is.

[Ladygold]

No, I'm not, but I do believe dogs want to have a purpose. They exist beside us, not below us.

uhh nope. Dogs like cats and other domestic animals were bred for human use they were "made" to be around for us. I adopted a cat Gaia from the human shelter last year and I love her to pieces and believe its my responsibility to make her life as happy as possible because humans have made this mess and its up to us to take care of it when we can. But… I believe in having domesticated animals fixed to stop the cycle.

Its very similair to the idea of slavery. Since aniamls are "owned" by us how can they ever be beside us?

LG

[Terran]

I do think the use of guide dogs is exploitation. I'm sure they enjoy helping people, but that doesn't change the fact that they are used in the first place to serve humans.

SmeepRocket, I don't quite understand how you can argue that police dogs aren't exploited. Yes, dogs like to have something to do, and yes, a lot of them want human companionship and affection, but when we use these things to our advantage, without the dogs being able to fully understand the risks and make a choice, then that's exactly what exploitation is.

[CoolCat]

These dogs are not forced to work, they are using natural abilities to help people.

Wanting to be become the alpha (fe/)male and dominate is a natural ability as well... are they allowed to do that too? Or are they only allowed to display the natural abilities that fit our needs? It is exploitation, even if the dog wags his/her tail whilst doing it.

[Ladygold]

Wanting to be become the alpha (fe/)male and dominate is a natural ability as well... are they allowed to do that too? Or are they only allowed to display the natural abilities that fit our needs? It is exploitation, even if the dog wags his/her tail whilst doing it.

Well said...I agree.

[MoonDance]

Not sure where I stand with the guide dog issue, though like Harpy said, I do agree that it is a benign form of exploitation. Riot dogs etc. on the other hand . . . humans should fight their own goddamn wars and not drag innocent creatures into the mix.

[Thai Dogman]

Dogs are my life! We have a rescue centre for street dogs here in Thailand and I also campaign against the trade in Dogs for meat (it is not legal in Thailand but dogs are stolen and smuggled to Vietnam). I have 4 companion dogs at home and have lived with dogs my whole life.

My thoughts are this:

Using a dog as a war animal is certainly exploitation however drug dogs enjoy their work because the whole training is based around a game. I don't have an ideological position and I think every situation is taken on its own merits. My house dogs 'work' as guard dogs by default since they naturally want to guard their own territory but they also guard me is that exploitation?

There is another issue that by spreading the use of dogs as 'useful' in east asia we get rid of the idea that they can be used as food. Its a tough balancing act.