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Thread: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

  1. #1

    Default "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    Holly Paige thought her family's food regime would boost their health – but stick-thin legs and rotten teeth made her think again...
    http://www.independent.co.uk/life-st...ll-848322.html
    I have meat eaters using this nonsense to argue vegan diet is not healthy!!!
    Any suggestions on counter arguments?
    Charlie

  2. #2
    baffled harpy's Avatar
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    Default Re: How our vegan diet made us ill

    Hi, I'm surprised your friends are still going on about such an old article.

    Some ideas from the Vegan Society here: http://www.indiadivine.org/showthrea...icial-response

    If you Google the author's name you can read more about what she ate and decide for yourself if that was a sensible - or typical - vegan diet.

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    Default Re: How our vegan diet made us ill

    Maybe they should watch an episode of that Jamie Oliver show where the kids were eating meat and had really unhealthy diets.

    Any diet if not done properly is bad. I am more healthy now, my vitamin levels are better than when I was a veggie. Because I put effort into eating properly.

    Maybe show them a vegan bodybuilding site and show them how healthy veganism can be.

    And some omni's have way too much time on their hands to go after something that really doesn't affect their life at all. Your health or what you put in your body is none of your business. They don't do it because they care, it's in a 'told you so' way.

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    Draíochta Blueberries's Avatar
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    Default

    The problem in that article wasn't veganism, it was a restrictive raw diet. The article touches on that a bit but still equates the children's cravings for fat and protein with a need for dairy. They have the token attempt to let the vegan society have their say but it is still an article coloured by clear personal bias. The woman who fed her children a raw diet did so entirely for health and 'purity' reasons. What I find strange is that she says that the diet she put her family on made het children ill, yet the article says that she runs a raw website? :/
    Houmous atá ann!

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    baffled harpy's Avatar
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    Default Re: How our vegan diet made us ill

    She seems now to advocate a raw but non-vegan diet, Bb.

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    Ex-admin Korn's Avatar
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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    Quote VeganCharlie View Post
    Any suggestions on counter arguments?
    Yes....

    1) Read what I wrote about the same article earlier:
    http://www.veganforum.com/forums/sho...l=1#post473928

    2) Ignore it, and ask the meat eaters you come across to argue with the world's largest organisation of food and nutrition professionals instead:
    http://www.eatright.org/Public/conte...60&terms=vegan

    "The Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics and American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) agree: Well-planned vegetarian and vegan eating patterns are healthy for infants and toddlers."

    3) Ask them to not compare vegans with health problems with non-vegans without them. As we all know, there are millions of non-vegans with health problems out there as well, and we can't explain all these cases with diet only ( - but many of them can b traced back too high consumption of animal products and too low consumption of plant based meals).

    4) If they think that vegans become deficient in more nutrients than non-vegans, show them this link:

    http://www.veganforum.com/forums/sho...than-in-vegans


    Good luck!

    PS - please check our FAQ: "3) Don't share links to anti-vegan articles/sites unless you also contribute to kill the myths they are creating.".

    Lots of people don't read the threads here, but browse through the thread titles. When they see someone called VeganCharlie which starts a thread called How our vegan diet made us ill, they get the impression that one of our members claim that eat he became ill by living on a vegan diet. I have changed the thread title to "How our vegan diet made us ill" now.
    I will not eat anything that walks, swims, flies, runs, skips, hops or crawls.

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    baffled harpy's Avatar
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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    Thanks Korn - I thought we had a thread about it but I couldn't find it.

  8. #8

    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    Quote Korn View Post
    Lots of people don't read the threads here, but browse through the thread titles. When they see someone called VeganCharlie which starts a thread called How our vegan diet made us ill, they get the impression that one of our members claim that eat he became ill by living on a vegan diet. I have changed the thread title to "How our vegan diet made us ill" now.
    Sorry Korn, you are correct certainly don't want to give people negative ideas. Was quite annoyed yesterday as somebody found it and emailed it to loads of people at work. I need to respond to the email but want to make sure my response is right and nobody can argue against it.

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    Ex-admin Korn's Avatar
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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    Hi again,
    no need to say sorry. Seeing such an article may trigger an impulse to just post the link on a vega forum and ask for comment in many people. The reason we added that paragraph (#3) to our board rules is that we saw that some people logged in only to post such links - and didn't even bother to come back and read the responses. Besides, it's not always easy to find earlier threads about similar topics. I hope you have some ida now in terms of how to respond to this article. If not, please post ask more questions!

    And again; just tell these people that loads of doctors and dietitians all over the world approve living on a vegan diet and even recommend it. So it's perfectly fine to just say that they need to discuss this with people who are experts on nutrition instead of you, and try to prove them wrong.

    There's no such thing as "a" vegan diet, one can live on junk food and be a vegan. So it has to be done right. But that's not something specific for vegans...
    I will not eat anything that walks, swims, flies, runs, skips, hops or crawls.

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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    People who do that, email others with the article, are just doing it to spite vegans. It's prejudiced and petty. Why do they care so much? It doesn't affect them in the slightets. There are more important things in this world than other peoples' diets.

    And as Korn says there is no such thing as a 'vegan diet', you can be a healthy or unhealthy vegan. Just like with omnis.

    Send them a photos of vegan bodybuilders lol. Mike Tyson is a vegan!!

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    baffled harpy's Avatar
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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    If you want to respond to the email, I wouldn't necessarily bother to address the specific points in the article as it isn't very coherent. You could just say you feel fine (assuming you do!) and add that there are loads of people who have been vegan for decades - in some cases for their entire lives - and are perfectly healthy - although sadly we're not all this fit http://www.buxtonadvertiser.co.uk/ne...thon-1-5581447

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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    Send them these videos!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgzOIROVVBI
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gxIhiGO0v4

    I wouldn't want to get totally ripped like a bodybuilder, but seeing stuff like this inspires me. I became a lot more health conscious after turning vegan and I always check out their meal plans for tips.

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    Draíochta Blueberries's Avatar
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    Quote harpy View Post
    She seems now to advocate a raw but non-vegan diet, Bb.
    I really dont understand what health benefits could possibly come from eating raw animal products... not just from a vegan point of view but also thinking about all the horrible bacteria and food-bourne pathogens... :/
    Houmous atá ann!

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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    Do you know something that so annoys me about this article - it's this - Calcium
    Found in dairy products, this is essential for strong bones. It is often lacking in a vegan diet unless taken as supplement.​I get angry about the myth that dairy = calcium.
    One of the best sources of calcium is treacle, also dried figs, almonds, -
    http://www.healthaliciousness.com/articles/foods-high-in-calcium.php and this is good - ​http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcom...k/sr17w301.pdf
    Sorry for the rant but even when I was just veggie, I never did dairy, and always had to go through the whole calcium lark.

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    Ex-admin Korn's Avatar
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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    Do you know something that so annoys me about this article - it's this - CalciumFound in dairy products, this is essential for strong bones
    I totally agree that this is misleading. It's easy to get enough calcium, for vegans, from *food*.

    Have you seen this clip?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...eKHJksxY#t=68s
    I will not eat anything that walks, swims, flies, runs, skips, hops or crawls.

  16. #16

    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    And calcium alone is not the cure all for bone density loss or the almighty protector of bones. I ate yogurt every morning for breakfast as an omnivore for years, and still ended up with osteoporosis. There were many factors...I have been on thyroid meds for years which increases risk, I used to smoke a pack a day for nine years (quit in 2006), I am small boned and have been underweight for many years for a number of medical reasons, genetics, and the biggest was having a hysterectomy and both ovaries removed at 33 years of age seven years ago (almost eight), and my first period not starting until I was almost 17. I had very little exposure to natural hormones which are crucial for bone turnover and health. All the calcium in the world alone won't help my bones (and yes I have had my vitamin D levels checked three times over the years and they are always spot on so that has not been an issue and I do supplement with D2). Also, a number of medications are known to cause bone density loss, from the SSRIs to some birth control (Depo Provera) and some acid reducer meds. More and more people are taking these medications without knowing about this consequence. It kills me that the focus is still on dairy with all that we know now...

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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    Robin, since turning vegan my calcium levels went up, and I was eating a fair amount of dairy when I was just veggie. I am healthier and feel so much better.
    I am lacking in vitamin D, but that's because I was lacking sunlight exposure and even the GP said it wasn't down to my diet as she sees vitamin D deficiencies in non- vegans/ veggies alll the time. Just due to how we live our lives, in offices or in work all day and not much exposure to sunlight. I think only 10% of vitamin D comes from diet, hence the reason many foods are fortified with it.

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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    And the other thing about osteoporosis is that it's not lack of dairy, as Robin said.
    In today's society a lot of it is caused by lifestyle, in particular lack of bone loading exercises, and also too much fizzy drinks. The high intake of carbonates can have an effect on bone density.
    The Vit D thimg is a difficult thing. I am a cold person and rarely wear short sleeved tops, it has to hit 25C before I think about putting a t-shirt on, so I'm probably lacking in it too.
    But even meat eaters are the same in that respect.

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    Default Re: "How our vegan diet made us ill"

    The mother in the article said something that gave it away. She said something to the effect that the children were always wanting to snack between meals, obsessed with food. I've been raw vegan before, and I lost too much weight. Not because of the diet: I was too busy to consume and prepare enough calories to hold my weight, which is normal to begin with. Athletes, busy professionals, and especially children need to consume a lot of calories on raw vegan. I've seen some pretty healthy children and young adults raised on raw vegan. I'm currently eating just one cooked meal a day (brown rice, mixed grains, and a little legume) and I'm holding my weight very easily eating the rest of my food raw. My personal experience is that it is probably much easier, less time consuming, and less likely to make tragic mistakes feeding children a normal vegan diet. Wouldn't there be some question about the rate of growth for vegan children. I thought that kids on the SAD diet were growing too much, obesity, too tall too fast (can lead to different skeletal problems later in life), huge breasts in very young girls from the hormones and tragic stuff in normal diets. Aren't people who are smaller, less weight, cleaner blood living longer? I'm asking, I don't know.

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