The Body Shop - what a crock!

[ConsciousCuisine]

If thier products weren't full of toxic chemicals, artificial colors and fragrances and such I may consider them an option.

[snaffler]

The body shop do sale a few products for men which have no animal by products in them, this is all a grey area.

From a vegan prospective I would view them as a Vegetarian Cafe that had some vegan options, or a main stream cafe that had Vegetarian and vegan options.

It would be nice to see them have 100% ethical products through out, but you must look at the bigger picture, they are a main stream shop but they are slowley changing the buying habbits and and the way that job public shop.

If you look at the bodyshop from a non-vegan way and ask the average job public which would you prefer to buy a tested or non tested product the biggest % will say non-tested.

Which for the anti-vivisection movement and the animals is good and a move in the right direction.

Lush are no different really again they do not test on animals and some of their products to have animal by-products in them.

Although we would all as vegan love to see NO animal by-products this is still a move in the right direction for the animals.

Yes I am mellowing in my old age but I have also noticed in the last 10 years the high street for Joe Public has become more cruelty free, it's not us that need changing we know what we are up to but for the average person in the street they need it in their face with no effort and commercial and big and branded to get them to go their and buy it.

We are happy to trawl the net for that pain free product but people are not all the same when it comes to this kind of thing.

To end it I would not be to hard on the bodyshop I would rather see them sale non-tested items than P&G/BOOTS etc pushing all the unethical crap.

[wilson]

I don't understand why you're all so angry at body shop?

that was the exact thought that was going through my mind as I scanned this thread. They've always struck me as a store that at least tried to be ethical, tried to raise awareness of issues like animal testing and violence against women. Perhaps the message to Body Shop here is "don't bother trying".

[ConsciousCuisine]

Perhaps the message to Body Shop here is "don't bother trying".

No, it's "TRY HARDER"

[Yogini]

This was several years ago, but when I was shopping there shortly after turning vegan and scouring every label carefully, a young employee attempted to help me. She enthusiastically explained their "no animal testing" policy (as I thinked they called it at the time.) But she had no idea what vegan meant and was baffled that I didn't want to buy a hand cream with lanolin in it.

Love,
Anna

[wilson]

No, it's "TRY HARDER"

well, OK , but everyone can always try harder...what about the many corps like Starbucks out there who are very happy to not try at all...

I agree it's important if a company gets on a platform of being about animal welfare then they should be held to it, to an extent, so they aren't just using it to get business. But even so, Body Shop is getting a rough ride in this thread, imo. I just think if some CEO or marketing department was reading a forum like this to gauge public feeling about consumer attitudes to ethical high street stores (I know, unlikely) the attitude might be "well, we're damned if we do and damned if we don't, so let's just take the cheaper route".

Plus, as was stated in a Body Shop release posted somewhere in this thread, they are not able to ascertain if everything used in every process is vegan. Businesses are in that unfortunate position of having to make money - I'm not trying to sound snotty, I mean that is their reality - at some point costs become an issue when there are 1000s of people on your payroll.

Another example: a housemate of mine worked until recently at a Bridgehead. This is an Ottawa based small chain of coffee houses where everything is fair trade, organic, shade grown, there are pictures on the walls of the actual bean farmers, you get the idea. And still, she said many of the people working there would criticise Bridgehead for being 'corporate sellouts'. Bizarre - you can't please everyone.

I am more than happy to support companies that make an effort to move in a certain direction.

Man, I don't seem to be able to write short messages...

[ConsciousCuisine]

well, OK , but everyone can always try harder...what about the many corps like Starbucks out there who are very happy to not try at all...

Far be it for me to defend a corportaion like "Starbucks" but I have to say that they *do* have fair trade/organics available, they donate money and product/services freely and they pay thier employees well and have an awesome benefits package (including medical/dental/educational/401K and so on).

I don't drink coffee It is terribly unhealthy and bad for the environment etc.

[wilson]

Far be it for me to defend a corportaion like "Starbucks" but I have to say that they *do* have fair trade/organics available, they donate money and product/services freely and they pay thier employees well and have an awesome benefits package (including medical/dental/educational/401K and so on).

I don't drink coffee It is terribly unhealthy and bad for the environment etc.

Fair enough, but hey I just noticed that you are ONE post away from you 2000th post !!!

[abrennan]

Seems to me that the Body Shop is more an excersise in marketing than in ethics. I haven't shopped there and I won't be for the forseeable future. I need to ensure ny pennies get into the pockets of those who are really trying

antony

happy 2000th CC

[Roxy]

Well if anyone visits Vancouver, B.C. - be sure to visit Saje Natural Wellness . I find them a good alternative to The Body Shop.

[Lily]

Seems to me that the Body Shop is more an excersise in marketing than in ethics. I haven't shopped there and I won't be for the forseeable future. I need to ensure ny pennies get into the pockets of those who are really trying.

Exactly.

[abrennan]

Exactly.

Yeah we should rename this thread The Body Crock... what a shop

[Lily]

My wide-grin smiley won't work for some reason but I'll try once more...

[princessemma]

I went in my local branch today and the woman working there said you have to have a certain amount of lanoil to make soap foam or something!!!! Anyway I said I was vegan and she said all our products are natural. I said I apprieciate that but I can't for example use honey. She said but it's natural straight from the bees. I really don't think she understood. Are any of their handwashes and/or soaps vegan? Anyone?

[abrennan]

You have experienced The Body Crock......what a shop

[Mr Flibble]

Dunno, but if you can afford body shop soap, buy lush instead. It's nicer and properly labelled.

[abrennan]

[pat sommer]

ie: I am more than happy to support companies that make an effort to move in a certain direction.
Amen. esp when trying to influence mainstreamers

Just politely inquiring about vegan products can be a real opportunity to educate anyone within earshot... If I am nicely dressed I do this at dept store
cosmetics counters- take in their expression when They learn what collagen is!

[Roxy]

What is collagen? I've heard of it and know that it is supposed to help wrinkles, but what what is it really?

[Lily]

I've just consulted my dictionary, Roxy:

collagen n a protein in fibrous connective tissue, readily turned into gelatine.

Probably best to stick with the wrinkles then!

[Roxy]

Thanks Lily. Yes it does sound gross! I wonder if there is a particular animal that they take it from.

[abrennan]

[Roxy]

So is connective tissue like muscle?

[princessemma]

That's so disgusting! I found some great vegan soaps in Superdrug but I couldn't find any vegan handwash. You all seem to hate the Bodyshop but I was shocked at how many companies are allowed to hide their true policies. IAMS Petfood test on cats and dogs the same animals they advertise as benefiting so greatly from the 'food' they make, and do these companies ever inform their staff of anything? The woman advertising it (IAMS) in Tesco's when I went in a few months back thought I was crazy. She said she loved animals and would never work for a company that did such things. And all the cheese, butter and milk adverts show happy cows in lush green fields. Shouldn't this fall under false advertisment?

[pat sommer]

live-cell therapy was big few years back. Undifferentiated cells (collagen producing) were injected into creases. This was readily available from the slaughter-house ie unborn calves. The public got hooked on the collagen - wrinkle link and the ingredient was then extracted from a wide range of slaughter waste to be dumped into over-hyped beauty products where it acts as an emollient. And we think of the ancient romans as decadent!

[abrennan]

MMMmmm I wouldn't call it decedant, that's reserved for chocolate and ice-cream in my book. I'd call it BIZZARO

[wilson]

And we think of the ancient romans as decadent!

well, they did love their orgies...

[Roxy]

live-cell therapy was big few years back. Undifferentiated cells (collagen producing) were injected into creases. This was readily available from the slaughter-house ie unborn calves. The public got hooked on the collagen - wrinkle link and the ingredient was then extracted from a wide range of slaughter waste to be dumped into over-hyped beauty products where it acts as an emollient. And we think of the ancient romans as decadent!

GROSS!!!

[mew_76]

I can't believe what Im reading about The Body Shop!!!! Their popularity is based on their 'animal friendly' message and I would have thought that they would strive to make their products vegetarian/vegan as part of their company image as an environmentally sound business. Its wierd. I guess its cheaper to use that animal based stuff.

I think its ok and right to be disappointed by The Body Shop as their whole company persona is misleading. They allow people to assume things about their products, which leads to more sales, but it just goes to show you can't be complacent and assume things as I totally would about a company like that.


I LOVE your cats Vegan Bear, Talian's paws are too cool!!!! What a legend!

[Roxy]

I think a big part of their problem is that their staff are not properly trained. Therefore they pass mis-information along to the public which gives the company a bad name.

[LittleMissVegan]

In the animal free shopper is says, "The Body Shop cannot state that any state that any of their products are free from animal derived ingredients.".

I have got a Christmas present today- a nail kit from The Body Shop off a friend who wad dead chuffed with herself cos she had found a vegan present. I didn't tell her it wasn't as I didn't want to upset her after she had tried so hard so I asked her how did she know it was vegan? She said she asked the shop assistant who had a book of vegan products The Body Shop sell?!?

So The Body Shop as a company tell The Animal Free Shopper one thing and the their sales assistants are telling customers something different?

Has anyone had any feedback or info on this?

[Tigerlily]

Nope, as far as I know, almost all their cosmetics and body products/bath stuff contain animal derived ingredients (beeswax being the most popular). But they do not test on animals.

What is included in the kit? And are there any ingredient lists on them?

[LittleMissVegan]

There is a hand wash and hand moisturiser. The only thing I can see is Glycerin- It doesn't state if it is animal derived or not- So I presume it is animal derived. I think it's safest not to use it.

[VeganJohn]

Awwww, sorry to hear that LittleMissVegan. At least your friend tried though! If you don't want to use it, you could always give it to a charity shop??

[LittleMissVegan]

Good Idea VJ!! I really am gonna have to write a letter of complaint to The Body Shop about their sales assistants saying things are vegan when they aint (When I am more sober of course LOL)

[VeganJohn]

Yeah, best to sober up a little before you start to write the letter lol!!

[Mr Flibble]

There's an existing thread about bodyshop on this forum which I'm too lazy to search and link to right now, possibly as a result of too much sherry

Basically, as far as I know the bodyshop haven't even ever said that either them or their suppliers don't test on animals. All they ever say is they're "against it", which really means shit. Most meat eaters are against animal cruelty, but they still eat meat!

[LittleMissVegan]

There's an existing thread about bodyshop on this forum which I'm too lazy to search and link to right now, possibly as a result of too much sherry

Basically, as far as I know the bodyshop haven't even ever said that either them or their suppliers don't test on animals. All they ever say is they're "against it", which really means shit. Most meat eaters are against animal cruelty, but they still eat meat!

LOL i'll have a search tomorrow as my finger co-ordination aint too cracking at the moment- I'm typing as fast as a slug on speed at the minute (Sorry not a very vegan expression...). Tar Mr F

[VeganLiz]

They onlu use vegetarian glycerin at body shop so it might be ok. However, they use lots of other non vegan products e.g. lanolin, beeswax etc

Liz X

[LittleMissVegan]

They onlu use vegetarian glycerin at body shop so it might be ok. However, they use lots of other non vegan products e.g. lanolin, beeswax etc

Liz X

I can't see anything else in it apart from the glycerin. If I'm not sure of somet though I prefer to not use it!

[herbwormwood]

I don't understand why you're all so angry at body shop? no, they're not perfect, but is it just me that looks at the positives when so few companies have any?In a mainly non-vegan world, the body shop have potential. and you should remember, that the body shop made animal testing an issue when people had never thought about it beofre. *if* they do use stuff that other companies have animal tested then they do need a huge kick up the arse but maybe they dont, dont jump to conclusions so easily and look at their good points.
I would just rather save my aggression for other more deserving companies, if we can't accept all non-perfect companies, I don't think I could handle living in such negativity (its hard enough as it is)

I used to buy a lot of stuff from the Body Shop in the 1980s when I was a vegetarian teenager. I enjoyed the natural image they had and that they were standing up to say animal experiments were wrong. Plus they had a wonderful display of about 50 glass bottles of perfume and you could just test as many as you wanted without buying any. It never occured to me at that point that animal ingredients could be in cosmetics!
Now I have gone vegan I live in a different city and there is a Lush shop opposite the Body Shop. I buy mostly from Lush. I check before I buy that the product has a green vegan dot on it. I haven't been in the Body shop for a long time but Iwould not rule it out, if there was something I could buy there, because in comparison with the big chemical companies I think they are good. I would check that the product was vegan. I also buy some perspnal care stuff in natural food stores and on the internet from vegan companies. An asian grocer's near where I live always stocks Amber soap and toothpaste, which is vegan and cheap and so rich and "lush"!!!
I think the Body Shop has had its day. I live in a very busy city which is popular for shopping, and ther are very few customers in the Body shop, even at the busy times like lunch time. Our city has 3 branches and I would say they are all not well used nowadays.

[NorVegan]

Do anyone know if the makeup brushes are ok? It is the only one i can afford for the moment as it seems that buying and importing Ecco Bella will cost quite a lot because of shipping and customs.

I am sorry if this question has already been ansvered, but the only thing I can find is informaton about hog hair brushes, and not the makeup brushes.

[tabitha]

Im sure The Body Shop could make everything vegan if it tried. Whats the point of saying you are cruelty free when the moisturising stuff has got lanolin - that didnt get there cruelty free did it.

[Kevster]

Hmmmmmmm

'L'Oréal mulls £650m Body Shop bid
By Simon English
Published: 24 February 2006
The Body Shop, the cosmetics retailer famed for its ethical stance, faces a potential takeover bid from the French make-up giant L'Oréal.'

'Anita Singh of Peta (People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals) said: "Big companies are learning that consumers care about compassionate cosmetics. We hope The Body Shop convinces L'Oréal to adopt more ethical standards."'

Well, i don't think this has been the case so far, a little over optimistic, can't say that Cadbury are busy changing their business practices, rather, they are reaping profits from the fair trade market as well as the exploitation market, it's all about the bottom line. That said, perhaps it is less tough for L'oreal to stop animal testing?

[RedWellies]

That said, perhaps it is less tough for L'oreal to stop animal testing?

I put a response from L'Oreal about animal testing in another post (think it was something to do with hair/cosmetics). They told me they voluntarily stopped testing in 1989.

[Kevster]

But the base ingredients they use have been tested, it is just the finished article that has not.

http://www.naturewatch.org/shoppingg...l_response.asp

[Kevster]

Slightly harsh satire piece i also happened to find when searching for L'Oreal....

http://www.comedyclub.co.za/feature/feature130.html

[Gorilla]

ha ha, that's funny Kevster.

i really hope L'Oreal don't buy the Body Shop there's no way the acquisition of such a company would make L'Oreal change their policies. i read today that Lush are considering buying the Body Shop as well, which would certainly be preferable, but obviously they wouldn't be able to offer the huge sum of money that L'Oreal can

[VeganMoominGirl]

I hate The Body Shop. For all they've supposedly done for animal rights, they're an incredibly hypocritical company. They base their public image on a) no animal testing, whilst using animal derived ingredients in their products and b) being natural whilst having toxic nasties in their products such as sodium laureth sulphate, and methyl/propyl parabens, ingredients which are NOT GOOD for humans or the environment. I'm not at all surprised by this pending corporate sellout. They've been little more than a PR campaign for the greater glory of "saint" Anita Roddick since their inception. There are FAR more ethically minded and truely natural companies that I prefer to spend my hard earned cash on. Its the existence of companies like Green People and Faith In Nature that put The Body Shops' paltry efforts to shame. Roll on Lo'real, expose The Body Shop for what they really are I say - money grabbing corporate facists using the ethical bandwagon for their own capitalist ends. (rant over lol!)

[lozza]

while the body shop are buav approved, i dont see the bunny logo anywhere on any of their products (went in yesterday to have a look around).

and yeah i noticed there was quite a lot of lanolin & beeswax in most of their products. there were a few products that had glycerin as the only questionable ingredient, but i dont know if its animal or plant based.

i want to email them and ask..but i heard that they are murder to deal with..

even though they are buav approved, i think i am still going to steer well clear, cos i know that if i start buying stuff from there, somewhere along the line i am going to end up with a product that has animal ingredients.

also..i dont like thier attitude about most other ethical issues. i do believe they are exploiting 3rd world countries.

i prefer lush anyway i really hope they dont buy over the body shop..cos i can see them being bought over from l'oreal. grrr.then where will i shop?