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Thread: Using old leather and other non-vegan products

  1. #101
    (Ab/i/gail) AbFab's Avatar
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Hi, Jo1234.

    I don't claim to speak for anyone else, but I for one WOULD consider someone who in pre-vegan days purchased something non-vegan, as still a vegan now, even if they haven't gotten rid of said item, but don't contribute any more to the meat and by-products industry. I think it's all about trying, and being realistic. Personally, I have always hated leather sofas - they get hot and sweaty in the summer and you have to peel yourself off them. Plus I can just SMELL them!

    I know what you mean about the unnecessary lack of labelling - it seems so pointless, and I really don't know why more companies don't do it wherever they can. Maybe they can't make a commitment to keeping that item vegan, maybe it's made on a production line where there may be cross-contamination. Maybe they think it will put off the rest of the consumers who see the vegan label and think 'eurgh, this is bound to be tasteless and bleurgh'. I don't know. Keep hassling them, I reckon!

    Keep up the good work.
    Vegans go all the way.

  2. #102
    Gliondrach
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Hello, Jo, and welcome.

    It doesn't matter if you still have leather things. As you say, the animals aren't suffering now. I still have a few leather things. I've had them for many years.

    Regards,

    Martin.

  3. #103
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Like others said.. if you already have leathers in your house-hold it is fine. There is nothing much you can do about it. You are a vegan if you don' buy leather stuff from now on. No worries.

  4. #104
    Gliondrach
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    I've only just managed to get back on here. I lost the connection at about 6 o'clock - more than four hours ago. I don't think I was the only one because, until just a minute ago, there had been no posts since before that time.

  5. #105
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Quote Gliondrach
    I've only just managed to get back on here. I lost the connection at about 6 o'clock - more than four hours ago. I don't think I was the only one because, until just a minute ago, there had been no posts since before that time.
    Your not alone

    Joe, when i became vegan i had a few pairs of leather shoes and just bought non vegan ones when they became worn.

  6. #106
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    The forum is normally put offline when back-up, archiving and maintenance takes place. And it could be a long process.

  7. #107
    Seaside
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    This is one of those gray areas in which it is not exactly correct from a vegan viewpoint to say keeping old leather items is 100% fine and good, or 100% bad and unveganly. If someone is out leafletting and trying to gain converts while wearing their old leather jacket because it hasn't worn out yet they will look like a hyprocrite to people who are unfamiliar with veganism. People who were wearing leather clothing while throwing red paint on people who wore fur did not make a very good impression on outsiders. A person shouldn't feel bad about major purchases made before they were vegan, but they shouldn't be content with keeping them because they purchased them before they went vegan.

    My dad has a leather sofa, and if there is someone sitting in the only cloth covered chair in his living room, I will sit on the floor. But that is me. I gave up using leather before I gave up eating eggs and cheese.

  8. #108

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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    i am going through the same problems. i just turned vegan and have avoided leather shoes, but the weather is going to get cold soon and my flip flops aren't going to cut it. i have read on this forum that converse was bought out by nike. can't really wear those in good conscious. i hate being poor. i am so torn by what to do. i got a good pair of walking shoes for christmas last year, maybe i should just donate them. but what will i wear? this christmas my family will get a very detailed list.


    i haven't worn leather since going vegan, wouldn't feel right doing it, but i feel it is a personal choice.

  9. #109
    AR Activist Roxy's Avatar
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Jo, I would say the same as mostly everyone else here. I would consider someone a vegan if they are living a vegan lifestyle to the best of their ability, but they own a leather item purchased in their pre-vegan days.

  10. #110
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    well, everyone here is right, i think...however, and i don't think i've ever admitted this here, but i don't actually tell people that i am vegan simply because i do have leather seats in my car and we do have leather furniture in the house---these are things that my husband picked out/bought before we were married, but since i drive the car and sit on the couch, i feel a little hyprocritical calling myself vegan...which of course is just the choice that i am comfortable with. i just tell people that i don't eat meat, eggs or dairy and that i don't believe in using or abusing animals (including humans)

  11. #111

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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Quote Michelle
    well, everyone here is right, i think...however, and i don't think i've ever admitted this here, but i don't actually tell people that i am vegan simply because i do have leather seats in my car and we do have leather furniture in the house---these are things that my husband picked out/bought before we were married, but since i drive the car and sit on the couch, i feel a little hyprocritical calling myself vegan...which of course is just the choice that i am comfortable with. i just tell people that i don't eat meat, eggs or dairy and that i don't believe in using or abusing animals (including humans)
    i understand what you mean about not labeling yourself. i still have cleaning products, lotion and shampoo i need to use up before i can say i am 100%, but when you tell someone you are vegan they only question the food aspects, which can lead to a good conversation. if i had money i would just donate everything questionable, for now i just threw away 3 lip balms in my purse because they contain lanolin. my lips are getting chapped just typing this. need some vegan lip balm!

  12. #112
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Quote mophoto
    my lips are getting chapped just typing this. need some vegan lip balm!
    you need this my vegan friend! just look at the flavours they have to choose from!!

  13. #113
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    My, how your looks have changed!
    Eve

  14. #114
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Bring back captain Kirk

    "Spock, I want an investigaton and a report"

  15. #115
    Gliondrach
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Quote puffin
    Your not alone

    Joe, when i became vegan i had a few pairs of leather shoes and just bought non vegan ones when they became worn.
    I think that you may have become a bit confused there, Vainposter Slayer. You now buy non vegan shoes?

  16. #116
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    I wouldn't call someone vegan who found a leg of lamb at the bottom of their freezer 10 years later and had it for sunday lunch because it needs using up as opposed to giving it to a meat eating friend. However when it comes to things such as leather it isn't always practical to donate everything to charity and buy new things. Thankfully I didn't own a home when I turned vegan so I didn't have much, and since I've furnished a flat with my priniciples in mind from the start. I do still have a pair of trainers I got about 8 years ago (made by Nike of all people!) with some leather on for using when I go to the gym which are still in good condition (no comment!). It feels odd putting them on when I do, but I'd be a hypocrit for buying them in the first place if I were to just throw them away (they arn't new enough really to donate anywhere). I can just about bare people around me using animal products but wasting them (like when we go for a curry and my counterparts order about twice as much as they could ever physically eat) just shows a complete and utter lack of understanding or respect. So no, I don't think still owning a leather sofa still makes you less vegan.

    I can personally recommend, for the sake of well being, to donate it to charity (such as Oxfam in the UK who have second hand furniture stores) and replace it if you have the money. I get a lot of satisfaction out of having my own personal completely (touch wood, i've probably made a few mistakes and I'm not sure about one of the rooms in this rented place that has a carpet, the rest of floors are wooden) vegan space, knowing there's nothing dead or remains of anything dead lurking around the place. Of course it completely depends on your financial situation, personally it's something i'd happily spend a few months saving for.

  17. #117

    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    One of the most unique and wonderful things about being Vegan is the all the efforts we go to stay crulty free. As it has been said many times, it is almost impossible to become 100% crulty free, because in the long run with the history of products, some where there is probably something not vegan. No matter how many times you see the words. "All Manmade Materials". you always wonder. I for one will continue the quest and revel in all efforts to maintain as much freedom as possible, while doing what part I can to try and convince the rest of the world to change it's evil ways before it's too late.


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  18. #118

    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Funny, if I have a leather couch, but order vegan when I'm out - it would be weird if they said I wasn't because then they would try to feed me cheese, chicken or fish - Yuck!!

  19. #119
    Gliondrach
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    Default Re: questions for my vegan friends

    Quote gypsyveg
    Funny, if I have a leather couch, but order vegan when I'm out - it would be weird if they said I wasn't because then they would try to feed me cheese, chicken or fish - Yuck!!
    The first thing you should say, upon entering a restaurant, is: 'I don't have leather furniture, you know?' Just in case they are wondering.

  20. #120
    princessemma
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    It is quite confusing to a new-vegan what is and isn't vegan, I mean at what point you are a vegan as opposed to 'trying to be a vegan' I suppose in a way it's like a religion in that no-one is 100% but you do the best you can according to your circumstances. I personally will probably say I tried to live a vegan life-style as opposed to saying I am a vegan because there will always be that 'old jumper I thought was acrylic' or an 'additive in something not listed in the ingredients' strange because I always call myself a vegatarian even when I didn't know about gelatine or animal rennet in some foods until I'd been eating them a long time. I felt bad but still felt I was a vegetarian.

  21. #121
    Pilaf
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    The most important thing is that your heart is in the right place and you put forth effort, one step at a time. It's a journey.

  22. #122
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I would like to comment on using second hand leathers and wool as to coin it 'recycling'
    "Its bad karma to fuck with the stoned"- Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas Comentary (found on criterion collection)

  23. #123
    told me to Mr Flibble's Avatar
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    Quote TheFirstBus
    I would like to comment on using second hand leathers and wool as to coin it 'recycling'
    Do you mean when you say this if it's leather or wool you owned previously and are now using, or new second hand things you've acquired. If the latter, I'd argue that you're taking out of the second hand pool items which could be used by non vegans who instead buy new. Personally I got rid of everything I could afford to when i turned vegan, and I wouldn't want a bit of dead animal whether it's second hand or not.
    "Mr Flibble - forum corruptor of innocents!!" - Hemlock

  24. #124
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I don't think we live in a perfect world. There will be second hand leathers and wools and in some situations I don't see it as a breach of ethics to use the second hand ones.
    "Its bad karma to fuck with the stoned"- Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas Comentary (found on criterion collection)

  25. #125
    told me to Mr Flibble's Avatar
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I don't think we live in a perfect world either, but why buy an animal product when there's alternatives available? You're still supporting the trade in animal products, whether new or not, still increasing the chances of people buying new leather by decreasing the amount of second hand available and still increasing the likelihood of someone buying new knowing they can sell second hand.
    "Mr Flibble - forum corruptor of innocents!!" - Hemlock

  26. #126
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I kind of meat if you were in a thirft store or something. Also I was looking for a kilt recently, Traditionally they are made out of wool (I assume you know that already) but they also have poly vicrose kilts, here the problem: manufactering poly vicrose has quite bad enviromental reprocutions, and in those conditions animals may die in the bad enviroment (not to mention the ills on the enviroment). So would it be so terrible if I 'recycled' a second wool kilt??
    "Its bad karma to fuck with the stoned"- Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas Comentary (found on criterion collection)

  27. #127
    cross barer
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    Quote TheFirstBus
    I kind of meat if you were in a thirft store or something. Also I was looking for a kilt recently, Traditionally they are made out of wool (I assume you know that already) but they also have poly vicrose kilts, here the problem: manufactering poly vicrose has quite bad enviromental reprocutions, and in those conditions animals may die in the bad enviroment (not to mention the ills on the enviroment). So would it be so terrible if I 'recycled' a second wool kilt??
    Why do you need a kilt? If you need one that bad can't you make it yourself out of non animal stuff from the material shop?

    And what about second hand meat... have you thought about that? Whether you are the first second or tenth person to buy a woollen jumper or leather shoes, the animal was still exploited and is now dead.

  28. #128
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    Talking Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I hate sitting on leather furniture, all I can smell is death. Howver, I can understand why it would be impractical to get something new. I'm really perdandtic and can't have anything dead around the house . I have thought of having my partner made into a lampshade though when he goes, as he has lots of tattoos!

  29. #129
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I have friend who wear second hand fur and think it's ok I believe it is still advertising for those who participate in this horrible act of abuse

  30. #130
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    Quote adam antichrist
    Why do you need a kilt? If you need one that bad can't you make it yourself out of non animal stuff from the material shop?

    And what about second hand meat... have you thought about that? Whether you are the first second or tenth person to buy a woollen jumper or leather shoes, the animal was still exploited and is now dead.
    Well I don't see anything wrong with secondhand meat .

    Do I need to mention that I am only joking or can we take that as a given??
    "Its bad karma to fuck with the stoned"- Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas Comentary (found on criterion collection)

  31. #131
    princessemma
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    Perhaps this is two-faced as I am still using old leather and wool but I couldn't ever take someone wearing fur as a serious vegetarian or vegan because most meat-eaters disagree with fur. I am having problems finding suitable non-leather shoes for my daughter there seems to be only one site that sells them and they are not really what I had in mind. Yet there are loads for adults. Any suggestions anyone

  32. #132
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I don't know about the Uk, but in Australia you can buy lots of synthetic shoes for kids in large department stores like K Mart and Target. Try Marks & Sparks and yes I do hate buying from the multi corps, but if it's a choice between non animal and animal I will go there for limited supplies.

  33. #133

    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I don't see any problem with second hand non-vegan goods. I'd rather buy a wool shirt from a thrift store than a cotton shirt from an exploitative corporation. I go for what's most ethical, and if the wool shirt happens to be most ethical, then that's the one I'll get.
    Overgrow the government!

  34. #134
    cross barer
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    Quote Green_Faery
    I don't see any problem with second hand non-vegan goods. I'd rather buy a wool shirt from a thrift store than a cotton shirt from an exploitative corporation. I go for what's most ethical, and if the wool shirt happens to be most ethical, then that's the one I'll get.
    Why not just go without until you find a second-hand cotton or other vegan material?

  35. #135

    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    sometimes that doesn't really work... like when it's the middle of winter, and the only coat I have is a wool one that somebody gave me.
    Overgrow the government!

  36. #136
    HarleyT
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    Quote Green_Faery
    sometimes that doesn't really work... like when it's the middle of winter, and the only coat I have is a wool one that somebody gave me.
    Well they do say that wearing many layers is better than one large layer. Maybe considering wearing two thinner tops and a denim jacket? There are always options to every dilemma.

    Peace,
    xx

  37. #137
    vegan pizza! thecatspajamas1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I still use the beauty products that I have that may not be vegan or say not tested on animals, because it would be worse to waste them and throw them out. So, I use my old things up and then when I need to buy new things I buy them cruelty-free and vegan.

    I have some leather shoes from before I became vegan. I don't really wear them, because I feel like people would notice it and think I'm being hipocritical. I have a hand-me-down coat from my grandmother that is wool, but i wear it because it's second hand and it reminds me of her.

  38. #138
    vegan pizza! thecatspajamas1's Avatar
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    Default What to do with old shoes, etc.?

    When you went vegan, what did you do with all your shoes and belts and things that had leather in them?

    I've been vegan for almost a year now, but I still have some of these items in my room. I feel like I'm wasting them by not wearing them, but I'd feel guilty if I wore them. What about jeans with the leather tags on the back?

    I'm thinking I should either give these things away to friends or to the salvation army, or I could sell them on ebay and donate the money to an animal rights organization or animal shelter.
    Last edited by flutterby; Nov 2nd, 2005 at 08:42 AM. Reason: New thread merged with existing

  39. #139
    antony abrennan's Avatar
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    Default Re: What to do with old shoes, etc.?

    Quote thecatspajamas1
    When you went vegan, what did you do with all your shoes and belts and things that had leather in them?

    I've been vegan for almost a year now, but I still have some of these items in my room. I feel like I'm wasting them by not wearing them, but I'd feel guilty if I wore them. What about jeans with the leather tags on the back?

    I'm thinking I should either give these things away to friends or to the salvation army, or I could sell them on ebay and donate the money to an animal rights organization or animal shelter.
    I used them until I could replace them

    I have since replaced them all

  40. #140
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    Default Re: What to do with old shoes, etc.?

    Quote thecatspajamas1
    I could sell them on ebay and donate the money to an animal rights organization or animal shelter.
    Now there's a fab idea! Pay back.
    Sadly as I'm a student I can't afford to get rid of everything and buy new. I'll have to wait until they wear out and then buy new.
    I have ditched the non vegan bathroom unguents though - can't face rubbing dead animals on my skin every day
    Silent but deadly :p

  41. #141

    Default What should I do with my leather?

    I'm totally new to this transition, and I'm taking it slow. The meat and dairy issue I've got covered, I have clear goals in mind about how I want to handle that.

    The "animal products" is more tricky. I have a bunch of leather shoes and a couple leather bags. What did you guys do when you went vegan? Throw it all out and start again, or just wear out what you have now? I'm probably going to choose to just wear out what I have, unless I find a really compelling reason not to. I'm just curious to know what you all have done.

  42. #142
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    Default Re: What should I do with my leather?

    I'm wearing mine out even though I'm not very happy about wearing it.
    It seems an insult to the murdered animal not too make full use of it - Either that or give the stuff away to Oxfam, I may do that in time, trouble is as a poverty stricken student I can't afford new shoes right now
    Silent but deadly :p

  43. #143
    Geoff
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    Default Re: What should I do with my leather?

    I totally agree with Hemlock.

  44. #144
    vegan pizza! thecatspajamas1's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should I do with my leather?

    maybe you could sell them on ebay and donate the money to animal rights. i would like to do that with my old leather stuff once i figure out how to do an account.

  45. #145

    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I know it might sound weird but I don't want to give them away because they're nice things, and I'm afraid that whoever I gave them to would try to replace them when they were done!

    Like I'd give my boots to someone and they'd wear them out and say, "Okay, time to hit the store and find some more leather boots."

    Whereas while I'll miss the boots when they're gone, I'm already looking into animal-friendly alternatives.

    The one thing I worry a bit about though is environmental impact of the man-made synthetics. Has anyone looked into that?

  46. #146
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    Quote veganchicken
    The one thing I worry a bit about though is environmental impact of the man-made synthetics. Has anyone looked into that?
    Yes, and at this rate I will be going around naked or wearing a grass skirt.....brrrrrrrrrrrrr

    You just have to do your best with what we have, one day folk will gasp and laugh at our dilemmas because everyone will be vegan and earth friendly
    Silent but deadly :p

  47. #147

    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    Quote Hemlock
    Yes, and at this rate I will be going around naked or wearing a grass skirt.....brrrrrrrrrrrrr
    *laugh*

    Actually in a way I hope that will be true! Can't we make just about everything from Hemp these days?

  48. #148

    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I just found a page that addresses my own question:

    http://www.cowsarecool.com/environment.asp

    It talks about how leather is so heavily treated that it doesn't biodegrade the way most people think, and how the production of leather is incredibly damaging to the environment. Interesting stuff.

  49. #149
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I'm having the same trouble, VeganChicken. I have lots of old leather shoes and a few purses and my old favorite jacket. I can't afford to replace everything at once, but I have slowly found really cheap alternatives! I recently bought a really cheap (but cute!) fabric purse at Target as an interum until I can re-create my wardrobe. When I began to feel guilty for walking around in leather shoes, I looked online and found that alternatives to leather end up being cheaper, sometimes. I also discovered by reading labels that a lot of my old shoes and boots were already man-made! I was happy with that!

    I have not worn my leather jacket because I just can't anymore. I feel like the legs and head should be attached to the cow and draped over me to show my guilt! I would love to take the advice that thecatspajamas1 gave here and sell some of my things on ebay and donate the money to an animal rights group!! That's great!

    My biggest problem is one I am humiliated to admit... my very expensive car has leather seats. I didn't think much of it when I purchased it because it was standard in the car. Now I feel like I have to apologize each time I sit in the seats! I find myself embarrassed of the car when people comment on it in a good way. Next year, I will sell the car but I am stuck with it for now.

    I like your idea of wearing out what you have. I read once that to replace everything all at once may have less of an impact than using that energy and money on tools to teach others. I was once "called" on wearing leather shoes while not eating meat and I just told the truth: I purchased these before I researched what really happens to the animals. Now I choose to spend my time focusing on the animals who are still alive and need my help more; to help those animals who have not yet given their lives unecessarily... Even though it is the truth...I'd rather walk the talk and find very cool shoes and belts to wear that are not from animals!!!

    These forums are really helpful to me too to find good online shops for alternatives! Good luck!!
    Call me Candi! :D

    Also, add me on your MySpace account! http://www.myspace.com/vegancandi :)

  50. #150
    coney
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    Default Re: Using old/second hand leather or wool

    I don't have any problem using second hand leather or wool. It's actually a great idea (in this day and age, where knitting has come back in full swing) to go get used wool sweaters, unravel them and knit something new. Saves you tons of $, and you're not using new wool.

    I hate the oil industry more than the idea of wearing used leather, so really try not to buy fake leather, since it's made from synthetics and is supporting the evil evil oil industry which brings misery to billions of people, AND it will never biodegrade.

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