Things meat eaters say and do

[princessemma]

Someone's probably already said this one but I often get;

'but if everyone went vegan/vegetarian there would be too many animals'

and

'why can't you eat that?' (talking about about meat)
'I chose not to I'm a vegan and don't use products from animals'
'yeah that's really good because meat is so cruel all the pain and suffering'
then they tuck into their mcdonalds/steak/chicken nuggat!

another stupid thing my sister said not about meat eating but about me not wanting to be smoked over whilst pregnant

'but it's just a bunch of cells at the moment so it won't matter'

[moochbabe]

i remember bill o'reilly telling a lady from peta once that if everyone went vegan/veg that there would be no room for animals and crops, and that the world would suffer and everyone would die. he failed to mention the fact that this is what would happen if we kept breeding them at the same rate we r now.

another person was telling me: "but that's what the chickens r bred for, there's no other use for them, so if we didn't breed them, there wouldn't be millions of chickens!" i was like, o ya, and while we're at it, let's have tons of children and things even if we know that they will have to be over-crowded and that they are going to have a terrible existance in which they can do nothing natural for them and have their lives ended far before they should! sheesh, people...

[Yogini]

I keep remembering various comments I've heard over the years. A guy I dated was trying to understand what prompted me to stop eating meat and I explained that one day it just dawned on me that it was bizarre and wrong to love my cats the way I do but eat other animals. He actually said "But that's different. When someone's hurting a cat or dog, it's just to be cruel."

Oh yeah, I'm sure it lessens a cow's/hen's/fish's/etc pain to hear "just so you know, I'm not doing this to be cruel!"

Love,
Anna

[LittleNellColumbia]

Therers this chick from Home and away called Isabell Lucas and she's a pretty in tune chick, except i read an interveiw of hers and she said she ate all organic veggies...and tries to but organic pultry "becasue it must be horrible to be a battery hen".....i dont really know what to think of that. But i actually think she'll go veggie or vegan one day.

[Mystic_Skies]

I had a funny comment the other day when my girlfriend and I went out for some vegetable sushi at the local sushi bar. We asked for maki rolls with only vegetables and no fish and the waiter was like "No fish?! What, are you communist or something?!" We couldn't believe he said it! I've never had a waiter that outspoken before. Lol...

[moochbabe]

lol, pretty crazy... but y does not eating fish make u a communist, that's what i don't understand...

[aubergine]

BTW, I really get a kick out of people who are trying to say that it's OK with them to be gay, but feel obligated to say "well, I'm straight, but..." What they're really saying is that it's OK to be gay, but they sure as hell don't want anybody thinking THEY'RE gay. Same line of thinking goes into that "straight but not narrow" bumper sticker I'm always seeing.

The only reason I ever point it out is because I end up being miconstrued so often. Whenever I stick up for someone who is gay, people make a judgement about me aswell.

[greenworlds]

when talking about veganism to someone, he came up with..'there wouldn't be enough land to feed everyone on a veggie diet' I explained that it was meat production that was taking up the land space and a veggie diet takes up far less land to feed the some amount of people etc.I even hand delivered some information for him to read. I met him about a year later and he said the same thing...'there wouldn't be enough land to feed everyone on a veggie diet'.

[Yogini]

The only reason I ever point it out is because I end up being miconstrued so often. Whenever I stick up for someone who is gay, people make a judgement about me aswell.

What kind of judgment? That you're gay? Why is letting a homophobe believe you're gay so horrible? (Unless he's out to kick your ass or something.)

Love,
Anna

[moochbabe]

when talking about veganism to someone, he came up with..'there wouldn't be enough land to feed everyone on a veggie diet' I explained that it was meat production that was taking up the land space and a veggie diet takes up far less land to feed the some amount of people etc.I even hand delivered some information for him to read. I met him about a year later and he said the same thing...'there wouldn't be enough land to feed everyone on a veggie diet'.

i hate that! that's often the argument i get, and for a long time i believed it, and then i realized, not as long as not everyone goes immediately (which would be impossible) becuase soon enough there would be space where we could grow where there used to be animals crammed

[eclectic_one]

What kind of judgment? That you're gay? Why is letting a homophobe believe you're gay so horrible? (Unless he's out to kick your ass or something.)

Love,
Anna

Well, I can tell you that the town I live in is so homophobic that other labels go along with gay--mainly atheist and (for a woman) man-hater. Although I have nothing against atheists or homosexuals (I can't say I'm too big on anyone who "hates" a whole group of people), I don't like wrong labels period (which all those are untrue when directed toward me), but I especially hate how threatening--they might not literally "beat" you but they try to get you fired and the like or at least harass you--some of the people who use them are.

[eclectic_one]

BTW, I really get a kick out of people who are trying to say that it's OK with them to be gay, but feel obligated to say "well, I'm straight, but..." What they're really saying is that it's OK to be gay, but they sure as hell don't want anybody thinking THEY'RE gay. Same line of thinking goes into that "straight but not narrow" bumper sticker I'm always seeing.

I have a sign on my office door that says "straight but not narrow." I was tired of all the rumors about me, but also wanted my students who are gay (most of which stay in the closet because of my town's attitude) to know that they could be comfortable talking to me if they needed or wanted to. The man in the next door office when I put it up was gay (though there were less rumors about him) and he thought it was cool that I put it up.

[eclectic_one]

I even hand delivered some information for him to read. I met him about a year later and he said the same thing...'there wouldn't be enough land to feed everyone on a veggie diet'.

Maybe he didn't even read it...some people won't even consider differing viewpoints. But even if he did, people often just won't believe any information that doesn't agree with their view of the world no matter what. It's frustrating, but I'm sure I do it with my own views at times.

[greenworlds]

i hate that! that's often the argument i get, and for a long time i believed it, and then i realized, not as long as not everyone goes immediately (which would be impossible) becuase soon enough there would be space where we could grow where there used to be animals crammed

It was the first time I heard an augument that vegetation took up more space then animal for food.
If we took a garden say 50 feet by 30..and we had a choice to put animals or grow vegetation for food..I would go for the vegetarian even if I were an animal-eater as I can't imagine being able to sustain even one cow, a pig, chickens etc etc and trying to feed them with just the food grown on that land? much more sensible to grow the veg to eat directly.

[greenworlds]

Maybe he didn't even read it...some people won't even consider differing viewpoints. But even if he did, people often just won't believe any information that doesn't agree with their view of the world no matter what. It's frustrating, but I'm sure I do it with my own views at times.

I'm sure we all do at times, but for an important issue like killing and eating..you would hope that those who are trying to have an open mind would look into it...I mistook him I thought he was open-minded.. to know what is going on...or at least respect me enough to know I wouldn't say it without good reason. I realise he might not want to believe it just to justify to himself that eating animals wasn't harmful to the enviromental, who knows.

[moochbabe]

It was the first time I heard an augument that vegetation took up more space then animal for food.
If we took a garden say 50 feet by 30..and we had a choice to put animals or grow vegetation for food..I would go for the vegetarian even if I were an animal-eater as I can't imagine being able to sustain even one cow, a pig, chickens etc etc and trying to feed them with just the food grown on that land? much more sensible to grow the veg to eat directly.

too true, it saves from so much waste to just eat the veggies themselves instead of feeding it to an animal to fatten it and then eat what little of it that is edible (and not to mention many only want the "choice" parts)...
as for thinking that the guy would've wanted to know about the killing and eating thing, i've found most people would much rather not know and feel that they are right in what they are doing, they believe that ignorance really is bliss, although i would be a vehement protester to this archaic idea

[aubergine]

What kind of judgment? That you're gay? Why is letting a homophobe believe you're gay so horrible? (Unless he's out to kick your ass or something.)

Love,
Anna

Only because it's repetitive. I see this person almost every day and the subject of my diet comes up often. It's like they have a deep urge to prove I'm wrong.

[eclectic_one]

I bet someone's mentioned this before, but one comment one of my brothers makes all the time (he's not said it for a bit, but we don't discuss the issue much now) is that "animals are here to be our protectors (i.e., dogs) or eaten (everything else)...that's God's plan for all animals...animals like cats don't even have a reason for being"

[Nadine]

A (sort of) friend believes a similar thing we were having yet another (induced by him) discussion about veganism/animals & he said cats are our protectors because they struck a deal with humans in that they would kill vermin in return for food from humans... then going on to rant about how I was "breaking the deal" because I don't allow my cats to hunt freely. Grr... I think I fell asleep

[eclectic_one]

Obviously I don't agree with either of them, but at least your "friend" sees a "reason" for cats...BTW, I have an inside cat too...though I discourage it (I save them and take them outside when I notice), she does protect me from insects and spiders at times

[Yogini]

You all are proving my point for me. You think that being gay is acceptable, but you don't want people thinking you might be gay.

Love,
Anna

[eclectic_one]

Right, but I also don't want people to think I'm a meat-eater, atheist, man-hater, ignoramous, Freudian, etc. Are you somehow implying that someone is against the people that fit the label being misapplied? Like I said, I don't like wrong labels and the harassment that comes with them at times is frustrating.

[moochbabe]

i was thinking the same thing vander...

[Yogini]

Right, but I also don't want people to think I'm a meat-eater, atheist, man-hater, ignoramous, Freudian, etc.

All these labels you protest against seem to be things you think are negative. People who think you are gay because you voice anti-intolerance opinions are not going to change their minds just because you say you're straight. Not only does this help perpetuate the myth that being homosexual is a negative thing, it wastes breath, time, and energy. BTW, anybody who says or does anything even remotely feminist is going to be seen as/called a man-hater. According to some, wearing flats makes a woman a man-hater. Which is one of the ways I learned that people are stupid and you shouldn't worry what they think about you. Love, Anna

[moochbabe]

anna, i don't think it's necessarily things that vander sees as negative, but it's something that they are not, and a label no matter what sucks, but it sucks even more if you don't fit the category.

[greenworlds]

too true, it saves from so much waste to just eat the veggies themselves instead of feeding it to an animal to fatten it and then eat what little of it that is edible (and not to mention many only want the "choice" parts)...
as for thinking that the guy would've wanted to know about the killing and eating thing, i've found most people would much rather not know and feel that they are right in what they are doing, they believe that ignorance really is bliss, although i would be a vehement protester to this archaic idea

Yes thinking something is not true, just because someone chooses to believe it is why some many destructive elements in society still go on. I agree..the notion the ignorance is bliss is not a good philosophy to follow if we hope to learn something a worth on earth.

[Yogini]

The only time I get all het up over a label is when: 1) it's a label I don't like and 2) it's one that a reasonably intelligent person might believe. I can understand the fear that goes along with people thinking you might be gay. Around 1998 I was working in a group home for adolescent boys and chastized some of the residents for making very un-called for remarks about Ellen Degeneres. They got very disturbed that they were being supervised by someone they decided was a lesbian. I admit that I was bothered by this at first and my instinct was to protest. Then I thought about it and came to three conclusions: 1) it's counterproductive, because usually the person who insists she has nothing to hide has something to hide, 2) who cares what a bunch of stupid little boys think?, and 3) I prefer to walk like an enlightened, tolerant, free-thinking person and not just talk like one. Insisting that being homosexual is acceptable but being uncomfortable because someone thinks I might be gay is not in line with this philosophy. My sexual orientation is solely the concern of those whom I share my bed with and while it took some adjusting, I've grown quite comfortable with this conviction. Love, Anna

[moochbabe]

Anna, I understand where your coming from with that but the thing is, that is how you feel about mislabelings and when they upset YOU, this may not be the case for everyone...

[eclectic_one]

All these labels you protest against seem to be things you think are negative. People who think you are gay because you voice anti-intolerance opinions are not going to change their minds just because you say you're straight. Not only does this help perpetuate the myth that being homosexual is a negative thing, it wastes breath, time, and energy. BTW, anybody who says or does anything even remotely feminist is going to be seen as/called a man-hater. According to some, wearing flats makes a woman a man-hater. Which is one of the ways I learned that people are stupid and you shouldn't worry what they think about you. Love, Anna

Actually, the only one I listed that I consider truly negative is man-hater, as I see being a "hater" as a negative and useless way to be. (However, often that is due to an experience or experiences that they can outgrow if given the opportunity and education.) Obviously being an ignoramous isn't good, though it you're ignorant, you can educate yourself and get over it. I have nothing against meat-eaters as people, though I personally don't agree with their behavior or the lack of self-reflection in doing it...many of my closest friends are meat-eaters, but they know I'm not. I have nothing against Freudians, though I personally think Freud was wrong in many--but not all--things. Atheists I have nothing against, I've had many friends who were atheists and if they're respectful of my beliefs, I'm respectful of their "lack" of religious beliefs. I have come to the conclusion that, as you say, you can't make people stop labeling you (even when they mislabel you), but that doesn't mean I feel that I should meekly accept the labels w/o at least trying to educate them about why they feel it is appropriate to continue labeling people--even when the label is false. In my social science classes, I find it VERY important and relevant to point out how wrong stereotyping is and that you should NEVER label anyone--as even an "appropriate" label is too limiting when you're talking about a human being. I agree that you often can't change the belief of the "labeler," but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't try to. So yes, I will continue to dislike being mislabeled, but I don't think that makes me in any way prejudiced against those who are "labeled" appropriately. (As a matter of fact, many of my students have talked to me privately because of how open-minded and accepting they find me, even when I attempt to shed the misinformed labels--as that often leads to further discussion about why people insist on "mislabeling.")

[eclectic_one]

The only time I get all het up over a label is when: 1) it's a label I don't like and 2) it's one that a reasonably intelligent person might believe. I can understand the fear that goes along with people thinking you might be gay. Around 1998 I was working in a group home for adolescent boys and chastized some of the residents for making very un-called for remarks about Ellen Degeneres. They got very disturbed that they were being supervised by someone they decided was a lesbian. I admit that I was bothered by this at first and my instinct was to protest. Then I thought about it and came to three conclusions: 1) it's counterproductive, because usually the person who insists she has nothing to hide has something to hide, 2) who cares what a bunch of stupid little boys think?, and 3) I prefer to walk like an enlightened, tolerant, free-thinking person and not just talk like one. Insisting that being homosexual is acceptable but being uncomfortable because someone thinks I might be gay is not in line with this philosophy. My sexual orientation is solely the concern of those whom I share my bed with and while it took some adjusting, I've grown quite comfortable with this conviction. Love, Anna

I guess I should've read this before replying to the previous post. As you are labeling all of us who don't like being mislabeled as somehow intolerant and prejudiced, you've already decided we are regardless of what we say or how much our lives do not support that proposition. Since, as you said, "it's counterproductive," I guess that applies to this situation as well...we'll just have to agree to disagree.

[moochbabe]

well put vander. also, i think that mislabelings can be hurtful, even if you don't think anything bad about what you have been mislabled as, becuase you know that whoever said it was intentionally trying to be mean, and that maliciousness can be enough to be hurtful in itself.

[treehugga]

I went to my gym this week to have an assessment for a weight loss program they have going.

I explained I was a vegan and was told "no problem, we'll go over the vegetarian option with you. It has lots of variety. You have a weight loss drink for breaky, weight loss drink and salad for lunch, some fruit. Oh and fish for dinner" "What" I said "Did you say FISH !" "Yes, there's nothing wrong with fish. It's good for you" . I went on to explain that neither vegans or vegetarians consume fish, which the woman refused to believe and informed me that "Just because you don't eat it doesn't mean other vegetarians don't like it. In the end I just told her to check the dictionary for the correct meaning .

To make matters worse the weight loss drink was made from whey so I couldn't have it and it is the mainstay of the program.

The poor girl was so flustered that her hard sell didn't work on me and I was obviously in the too hard basket.

I think she was glad when I left .

By the way I am writing to the head office manager to inform them nicely how disappointed I am that they are misinformed about dietry requirements. And to think they use a qualified dietician.

[aubergine]

And to think they use a qualified dietician.

Unfortunately that doesn't count for much.

[Hemlock]

I went to my gym this week to have an assessment for a weight loss program they have going.

I explained I was a vegan and was told "no problem, we'll go over the vegetarian option with you. It has lots of variety. You have a weight loss drink for breaky, weight loss drink and salad for lunch, some fruit. Oh and fish for dinner" "What" I said "Did you say FISH !" "Yes, there's nothing wrong with fish. It's good for you" . I went on to explain that neither vegans or vegetarians consume fish, which the woman refused to believe and informed me that "Just because you don't eat it doesn't mean other vegetarians don't like it. In the end I just told her to check the dictionary for the correct meaning .

To make matters worse the weight loss drink was made from whey so I couldn't have it and it is the mainstay of the program.

The poor girl was so flustered that her hard sell didn't work on me and I was obviously in the too hard basket.

I think she was glad when I left .

By the way I am writing to the head office manager to inform them nicely how disappointed I am that they are misinformed about dietry requirements. And to think they use a qualified dietician.

Wankers...........how can anyone be so stupid and still live!

[pat sommer]

When I pointed out that beauty product was unsuitable because it had a slaughterhouse ingredient, the counter girl replied that they didn't kill the animal for that reason.

Good excuse to educate anyone within earshot! I try to use short punchy comebacks while smiling but to begin a LONGER discussion I usually frame my initial response to an idiotic statement with: that's just what the industry/government/establishment wants us to believe!

[moochbabe]

Wankers...........how can anyone be so stupid and still live!

i think some of the problem is the misinformation out there and the fact there are ppl walking around calling themselves vegans and veggies that really rn't... don't blame them for the stuff they don't know, the only thing we can do is try to help them understand...but it is rather frustrating!

[foxytina_69]

when i first became vegan, alot of my friends would laugh at me and say i basically just ate dirt. it was quite funny though at first. i explained to them what i ate and that was it. they never said anything again.

[pat sommer]

I am sorry to read the comments by Yogini. Can we go back to the thread?

One sweet 11 year old girl proudly told me (after finishing her nuggets before coming to my vegan home) she was a CARNIVORE and loves meat.
I whispered to her that she was a carrion eater since her food was really long dead.

[nettie]

Love it !!!! Please can I borrow it for next time.?

[treehugga]

I went to a party last night and was offered a vegan spring roll only it wasn't. I was chewing my first mouthful and could taste a foreign chewy texture, yes meat! My partner also had several mouthfuls before he realised. It was awful . I felt sick for the rest of the night and didn't eat any more of the food. The meat eaters were amused, a couple of them and others were sympathetic. It goes to show how risky eating out can be .

[sugarmouse]

treehugga as we speak i am emailing a hotel me and bobillydylan stayed at recently, where i am miffed that the majority of the 'vegetarian' options onthe menu, were full of fish!Lol

[thecatspajamas1]

Here's something stupid that my cousin from Arizona said on the phone yesterday:

"Oh, I'm a vegan too! Well, I had eggs this morning because my mom made them for christmas. And I eat salmon. Because you NEED fish."

That's not even vegetarian, and she's saying she's vegan. Well, I'm really glad that she's making an effort to eat less animal products, but it bothers me when people say things like that.

[Roxy]

I know what you mean. I was reading somewhere the other day (I forget where), and a woman said she was a fish vegetarian.

That's a contradiction of terms! Phhhhht!

[moochbabe]

i was reading about something similar to that in a book, where a jewish man was saying that he was vegetarian, and then said that for certain occasions he eats fish. sheesh. pescatarians they call themselves...what-ever!

[eclectic_one]

I know what you mean...what really got on my nerves is that I bought a book about the McDougall diet for my mom who has quite a few health issues (he advocates a mostly vegan diet with no added oils)--she's probably never going to use it BTW What annoyed me was in the early part of the book, he was talking about how people label the diet vegetarian. Then he made a remark that he always tells people that he eats turkey at Thanksgiving and sometimes at Christmas, so that proves he's not a nut and he is "really still a good American." Now I know he's largely putting forth his diet for health issues, but I find it offensive that he is caving in to the omnivorous majority by tacitly agreeing with them that being vegetarian is odd or un-American

[Morna]

There are actually omnis I listen to when they tell me about health. One is my good friend Erica (name changed). She's a massage therapist and has taken a lot of nutrition classes. She didn't give me any of this calcium or protein crap. The only thing she asked about was B12, which actually IS a health concearn for vegans. Nice to know there are omnis with brains out there.

[puffin]

I was in the supermarket the other day and the man at the checkout said "are you vegan" i said "yes" he then went on to tell me about some soup he had made once that had loads of veg in. He then said "do you eat shrimps?"

[moochbabe]

I was in the supermarket the other day and the man at the checkout said "are you vegan" i said "yes" he then went on to tell me about some soup he had made once that had loads of veg in. He then said "do you eat shrimps?"

ai yai yai!

[Juice]

dialogue I was involved with today:

my friend Umbatu (name changed): so you don't eat ice cream?
me: soy ice cream rocks
Umbatu: yuck! that sounds nasty
Umbatu's wife Yolanda (name changed): you love soy milk, Umbatu
Umbatu: oh. yeah.

[thecatspajamas1]

LOL

(And how could something from a squeezed plant be gross compared to a colloid excreted from the glandular tissue of a cow?)